Marvel's Avengers Assemble "The Avengers Protocol, Parts 1 - 2" Series Premiere Talkback (Spoilers)

[Alex20]

Also apparently no one can lead the Avengers except Iron Man, at least that's the impression it gives us. Tony disbands the team because he doesn't think he can lead instead of just asking Cap if he wants to lead instead of him. Tony being an unsure leader is fine; having no one go "well if you don't want to lead then you don't have to" is silly.

Yeah, that part made no sense. It was clear that they were a team for a lengthy amount of time before with someone else in charge so why didn't whoever lead them before, Cap I assume, just step up and lead them again.

 

[macattack]

Yeah, that part made no sense. It was clear that they were a team for a lengthy amount of time before with someone else in charge so why didn't whoever lead them before, Cap I assume, just step up and lead them again.

There's probably a meta reason why Captain America is not leading the team, and that is likely for international audiences. The same thing hampered EMH for a while but EMH hid the issue better than what Avengers Assemble seems to be doing as I watch part 2 right now.

 

[trance2009]

Haha if non-americans seriously have an issue with Cap leading....that is quite stupid.

 

[Rick Jones]

I thought the 2nd episode worked better than the first did but there's still a lot of stuff that I hope is improved. A lot of the dialogue made me groan (e.g., almost any time Iron Man spoke). Most of the team have some sort of unlikable qualities on display (I really wouldn't mind seeing BW's constant condescension toned down, for one). Personally, I like when these shows make references to the movies, and I've liked that most of the Marvel shows from FFWGH to Ultimate Spider-Man have borrowed pieces to help construct their own particular realities but they've been a little heavy handed with it in this two-parter.

The one big disappointment for me is still the animated look of the show though. I probably set myself up to be disappointed here, and it's probably a bit unfair, but with all of the awesome action animation that's been on American television over the last decade, I really expected something a little more visually competitive. I'll just keep my fingers crossed for now.

 

[Webbed-Wonder]

I didn't really care too much for it. The animation is really stiff and pretty lazy in some spots, just seems like that typical Man of Action type of stuff I don't really like.

 

[Venom Melendez]

I liked how it other villains had cameos in the second part when the Red Skull sent out his invitations for the cabal, I think it showed you Attuma, Dr. Doom and either Malekith the Accursed with out his two-sided face of a strange version of Dracula.

It's the current look of Marvel's Dracula. I like the line up, though i think there might be more members and they did say some might turn down his invitation. I also like how each potential member have armies at their command.

And Since Attuma is in the show, i hope that means Namor will make an appearance.

 

[RoyalRubble]

Not a very impressive start to this new series. It wasn't horrible, but not as good as I hoped it would be. The story was very rushed at times and some things didn't really make a lot of sense. It'll take a while to get used to the new team roster and their voices. The interactions between the characters aren't handled as well as they were on the previous Avengers toon, most notably Iron Man who seems a little too stupid at times and the Hulk, who just comes across as too mean to the others (especially Hawkeye). The humor wasn't that good either but at least there weren't any cutaway scenes or sight gags like Ultimate Spider-Man suffered from in the beginning. The dialogue works for the most part though there's still room for improvement. I find it funny that Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes tried to build up to Captain America eventually taking leadership of the team from Iron Man, while this show is trying to make Iron Man the leader. I liked seeing the team work together to take down Red Skull and save the city from the exploding mansion in the final moments of the second part.

Animation-wise, still nothing spectacular. The designs for the main characters isn't too detailed, and their designs aren't really as awesome as they have looked in past animated series. I think there are too many scenes "inspired" from the live-action movie. It's obviously not a true sequel series to AEMH, but it doesn't really fit in with the current Marvel Cinematic Universe either; it could work as a new, stand-alone series but they're apparently setting it in the same continuity as Ultimate Spider-Man, hopefully that will work out in the end. I suspect Spidey will eventually appear on the show as well - most of the Avengers seen here have already shown up at least once in his show after all. But only for an episode or so, and without him becoming an Avenger; Falcon is the young new-commer hero in this show. It would be nice if we'll get some more information on all the fallen Avengers they mentioned in the first part. On another note, we've already had Avengers vs Avengers from the second episode. It's not that surprising since even AEMH used this approach a lot (especially in the latter half of the second season), but I didn't think the fights seen here were as entertaining.

Red Skull is apparently going to be the main villain on this show; I don't really mind though I hope his next appearances will be better than this one. His design doesn't look that great but his voice actor did a pretty good job. I liked MODOK, with his powers upgraded; he comes across as more threatening than he usually does. The idea of forming the Cabal of super-villains might lead to some interesting stuff later on. I doubt Doctor Doom would actually ally himself with Red Skull, but I'm looking forward to see if Attuma or Dracula will (if the former appears, then hopefully Namor the Sub-Mariner won't be far behind), as well as any other villains that weren't shown in this episode. Also, the ending with the Great Wall of China turning into a dragon - I doubt they'd actually continue it from where the episode left off, or if they'll mention this fight in any future episode, but the first though I had was that was the Mandarin's work and the dragon was supposed to be Fin Fang Foom.

Final thoughts: there's still room for improvement but overall this was a pretty decent start. I liked certain parts (the hall with statues of fallen Avengers, for example), the action scenes looked good for the most part though they were a little too rushed. This show seems to have a lot of potential so hopefully it'll just get better from here. While I doubt I'll ever actually enjoy it as much as I did AEMH, this could turn out to be a fine cartoon in the end.

 

[Stu]

I didn't find a lot to like here. The first part was poorly structured around the team getting back together and tried to appear like it was a conclusion to a story thread we have not seen. I think the show would've started a lot stronger had we been given a justifiable reason as to why the team broke up in the first place.

Iron Man clearly likes the sound of his own voice too much - breaking the team up again in part two made no sense and his justification for the same was lame.

The new casting will take some getting used to. Iron Man's new actor sounds far too smug without a shred of liveability to him. That's dialogs sounds too jilted and comes across as too corny to take seriously. The fact his voice actor hams it up too much doesn't help. The rest of the cast seemed fine.

The animation was fine, despite some odd colouring. The show is attempting to keep the more modern appearances for its characters and it works in most respects.

Something feels very off about the show, however. The humour rarely worked, Iron Man is too weakly written to a riveting leading character and the whole episodes suffers because none of the remaining Avengers are smart enough to take over leadership (something which is synonymous with Captain America).

Hopefully now the team is back together, future episodes will be stronger. If not, the Man of Action formula has surely failed.

 

[W.C.Reaf]

There's probably a meta reason why Captain America is not leading the team, and that is likely for international audiences. The same thing hampered EMH for a while but EMH hid the issue better than what Avengers Assemble seems to be doing as I watch part 2 right now.

I always assumed that it's because Iron Man is more popular from a Marketing perspective.

 

[AlgeaX]

I always assumed that it's because Iron Man is more popular from a Marketing perspective.

Indeed, speaking as an Irish fella, I love Cap but Tony's movies make more money at the box office so he gets to be in charge.

 

[LexHugo86]

I definetely liked Hawkeyes redesign, with those cool purple sunshades. Red Skull and Modok working together reminds me of the 90s iron man series, with Modok working with Mandarin. The design almost looks like that of Ultimate Spiderman. But its still strange how after all they fought against red skull back in EMH, why didnt they just kill the Red Skull? I also see Hawkeye, Red Widow, and Captain America as being the weakest of the Avengers. Hawkeye is the worst, still using his lame bow and arrows, when he could just pick up a lazer gun or 2, i still dont get why the others dont criticize Hawkeye for his use of his bow. Ironman being the leader should kick Hawkeye out of the team if he doesnt switch to better weapons. With how slower it is to load an arrow, the enemy will have time to attack him from behind, and brake his bow. Im waiting to see if perhaps in this series, Hawkeye will finally realize his bow and arrows are outdated. I also hope that Captain America will finally start using a gun with that shield like he did in the movie. And Red Widow will decide to wear one of Starks armors So while i do like the Avengers, i dont like how the avengers has to consist of weaklings and powered heroes. The Strongest of the Avengers are Ironman, Thor and Hulk.

 

[RoryWilliams]

The fact that the show debuted in the same month as Iron Man 3 probably helped too.

 

[.c.h.r.i.s.]

I echo many of the previous sentiments...

While I liked the "look" of the show, I was not overly impressed with the execution of it. I think it has a ton of potential, they just need to match the writing quality of EMH. Fortunately/Unfortuately, EMH (specifically Chris Yost) set the bar so high with the writing and character interactions... The new team in charge would be wise to try and replicate some of that magic.

I had to compare this to the Breakout Part 1 and 2 from EMH, while I realize they were not the first two episodes, they were the first two that aired. Those two episodes were fantastic and so action packed. I had hoped AA would be able to top this, but sadly they have yet to do so.

I'll give it a few more episodes, because I want it to be awesome, and really hope I get to see that. But if poor writing continues to plague the series, we may be in for a big disappointment.

 

[Venom Melendez]

While I liked the "look" of the show, I was not overly impressed with the execution of it. I think it has a ton of potential, they just need to match the writing quality of EMH. Fortunately/Unfortuately, EMH (specifically Chris Yost) set the bar so high with the writing and character interactions... The new team in charge would be wise to try and replicate some of that magic.

I disagree, the new show should try telling their own stories and not copying what EMH did.

I always assumed that it's because Iron Man is more popular from a Marketing perspective.

That is the most likely reason and now Iron Man 3 is making big money at the box office.

 

[Medinnus]

I disagree, the new show should try telling their own stories and not copying what EMH did.

Agreed, but I think that the OP was referring to the level of quality of the writing - the characterizations, the plots, and the interactions between characters. I hope that the AA stays far away from ground that AEMH did, but that doesn't mean that they have to write simplistic plots with no subplots, bad dialogue cloned from the movies, and interactions that are less engaging than your average Archie comic.

That is the most likely reason and now Iron Man 3 is making big money at the box office.

Yep - but part of that is the years of cartoon exposure to build the Iron Man brand, and part of that is due to excellent writing/performances.

It's obviously not a true sequel series to AEMH, but it doesn't really fit in with the current Marvel Cinematic Universe either; it could work as a new, stand-alone series but they're apparently setting it in the same continuity as Ultimate Spider-Man, hopefully that will work out in the end.

I think that's likely, and I suspect it'll also be in-continuity with Agents of Smash, and anything else that comes out under the Loeb leadership (not that its a bad thing). I hope Hulk leaves the Avengers when his own series comes out... This version seems a lot more mean-spirited, and the casual thumping has gone beyond amusing and into the Trite Zone already.

 

[BigEclipse]

Ultimate Spider-Man is to Spider-Man and his Amazing friends as Avengers Assemble is to Challenge of the Superfriends...

 

[suss2it]

This was an okay debut. Wasn't nearly as bad as some people make it out to be, but definitely not one of the standout debuts of the last couple years.

The animation was rather poor and also fitting in the rather bland nature of the show. The "cinematic" editing style is rather badly done. It just feels like it's trying to hard to be the movies without actually understanding why the movies are well liked. So they just end up trying to copy them, which just feels hollow. Also if they're going to have Tony put on a new prototype suit then at least make it a different design than his old one or don't bother with a new suit.

Yeah, the constantly changing of the aspect ratios gets annoying quickly. And I definitely agree about the last part. The way they hyped it up I was expecting them to debut some new cool Iron Man design, but nope its the exact same thing we've already seen before. Missed opportunity.

I said possible look at whatever happens, not what will eventually happen, based on how film influenced the show is, ranging from the extreme amount of armors Tony has to Hulk's seemingly beige pants.

Of all the things that were inspired by the movies, those were the first two to come to you? In almost every incarnation of Iron Man he has an extreme amount of armors, that's in no way a thing unique to the movies, but maybe you're onto something with Hulk's pants color.

I think some of us here are suffering from sour grapes in Jungle Japes.

Just like when USM came on, people are mad that a good show such as SSM (and in this case, EMH) got replaced. But that's just business, nothing we can do about it.

However, unlike USM, I think Avengers Assemble isn't a terrible replacement to EMH. I don't know if it's just me, but I find the overall look of Avengers Assemble to be more pleasing to the eye than EMH. The colors just look more toned down and appealing I guess. Although the story is by no means the level that EMH had, I think it can still hold its own. The whole idea of Red Skull forming his own team to take down the Avengers is an interesting concept that could really lead to some interesting match-ups. The show isn't great, but it has potential.

I definitely agree. One of the few things I didn't like about EMH was the character designs. I much prefer the ones we're getting in AA. Just like with SSM and USM I feel like the replacement series has much stronger character designs, but in almost every other category is weaker.

 

[TheVileOne]

From a marketing perspective, Iron Man is more popular, and a British kid in a focus group hates Captain America because he hates America. So you can't make him the leader .

 

[AlgeaX]

From a marketing perspective, Iron Man is more popular, and a British kid in a focus group hates Captain America because he hates America. So you can't make him the leader .

Again, born and bread Irishman here, that kid's an idiot.

 

[GWOtaku]

I got part 1 off of iTunes. I have this vague feeling that something fundamental is missing compared to Avengers: EMH. It had heart this doesn't, at least right now. Taking a cue from Ultimate Spider-Man, the show loves its quips but all that dialogue would have more punch if there were characterization to back it up. So far there isn't because we are dropped immediately into this crisis situation, where there is little room to breathe as we move from one plot point to the next. For most of the first episode everybody believes Cap is dead, but there's next to no reflection or rumination on this or how it's impacted the team or the world. Avengers: EMH and Justice League took time out for such moments, and in general their stories were better for it. Assemble barely delivers the minimum effort, leaving the viewer to infer more than he or she should have to.

Consider this: throughout part 1 we see Tony rushing in brashly, not taking time to plan, making no effort to work with or help anyone else. The implication is he's rocked by Steve Rogers' "death" and putting revenge before all reason, which if done properly would not be so far off from how upset Stark was when Agent Coulson got killed (well, "killed" now. Feh) by Loki in Joss Whedon's movie. But the show is in so much of a hurry that it glosses over all of that, and the viewer has nothing to go on regarding their past friendship at this point. So it just falls flat when it really didn't need to.

There's a similar problem in general too, as not much is done to (re)establish the members of the team. The team getting back together doesn't feel like much of an accomplishment because it happens so easily and we know so little about why they even broke up before. I'd like to believe there's a really good story there somewhere, but rather than anticipation I'm left with feelings along the lines of "boy, this show has a lot to prove."

And boy, Red Skull stealing Tony's armor was exceedingly contrived. M.O.D.O.K. also seems overpowered beyond all reason. He can press a button and hold off the Hulk?