"Rogue One: A Star Wars Story" Talkback (Spoilers)

[James Harvey]

Rogue One: A Star Wars Story
Release date: December 16, 2016, with December 15 7pm (local time) showings
Studio: Walt Disney Pictures, Lucasfilm
Director: Gareth Edwards
MPAA Rating: PG-13 (for extended sequences of sci-fi violence and action)
Screenwriters: Chris Weitz and Tony Gilroy
Story by: John Knoll and Gary Whitta
Starring: Felicity Jones, Diego Luna, Ben Mendelsohn, Donnie Yen, Mads Mikkelsen, Alan Tudyk, Riz Ahmed, Jiang Wen, Forest Whitaker

Plot Summary: In a time of conflict, a group of unlikely heroes band together on a mission to steal the plans to the Death Star, the Empire's ultimate weapon of destruction. This key event in the Star Wars timeline brings together ordinary people who choose to do extraordinary things, and in doing so, become part of something greater than themselves.

Discuss Rogue One: A Star Wars Story! The good! The bad! Please Discuss!

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[Daikun]

Hey, how about that--there's a good Star Wars prequel!

I never thought I'd be able to utter those words. My friend and I just got back from an advance IMAX screening. We were so entertained by this that I think I might go see it again later.

I'm going to need to some time to process. It's late and I need sleep. Don't miss out on this, you guys!

 

[Classic Speedy]

It wasn't a bad movie but I must admit a sense of deja vu from a lot of the sequences. People criticized The Force Awakens of borrowing from other Star Wars movies, but I felt that a lot more in this one. We had Vader force-choking a subordinate, the walkers, a dogfight reminiscent of the Ep. III opening, K-2SO was basically C-3PO if he was a bit more surly and not a pacifist, etc. And in terms of non-Star Wars tropes, we had "someone among us is a traitor, step forward" and a lot of familiar war movie cliches in the last half hour.

I also didn't get into the characters as much as the other seven films. I don't want to give anything specific away but certain characters bite the dust and it didn't really affect me when they did. It goes without saying, but that's a problem.

And did anyone else think the movie had a dark and murky palette? Maybe it was my theater, but it didn't seem to "pop" like the other Star Wars movies I saw on the big screen.

The good: Tarkin and

Spoiler

Leia

. And as a fanboy I lit up whenever Vader appeared on-screen. And while he was thinly-written, I did like Chirrut Îmwe, the blind fighter, since he provided some great fight choreography. And I did like how things tied into episode IV.

More thoughts later if I think of them.

 

[TnAdct1]

I also didn't get into the characters as much as the other seven films. I don't want to give anything specific away but certain characters bite the dust and it didn't really affect me when they did. It goes without saying, but that's a problem.

Personally, the whole character death situation is one of the biggest issue with the film.

Spoiler

Yes, I know that these characters do not appear in the original trilogy. However, was it really that necessary for these characters to not be allowed to have adventures set in between these films and thus have them killed off in the final battle?

 

[defunctzombie]

I must admit I did not expect to see any of the New Hope characters outside of Vader in this movie. (Though Jimmy wasn't a big surprise, he was on The Talk and they kept trying to pry it out of him if he was in this.) The actress for Mon Mothma was spot on.

Spoiler

And damn son, Tarkin and Leia? Has CGI facial mapping gotten that good? The fighter pilots were an obvious reuse of footage, but I couldn't get over how well they made Tarkin look like Cushing came back from the dead.

But otherwise it came off a little like The Magnificent Seven In Space.

 

[Gold Guy]

Remember when Disney first got Star Wars, and people were worried that they would "kiddify" it?

Wow. Those concerns really don't hold up now.

This film really impressed me. It just felt so different, tone-wise, from all the other Star Wars films. This is definitely the darkest Star Wars film (in a good way; kudos to Disney for not flinching at the ending). The cinematography was gorgeous (is this the first Star Wars film that featured a beach and palm trees?) although some shots were a bit too dark.

Most of the characters were really likable, although I don't think any of them will reach iconic status, except maybe for K-2SO.

But Vader...man. He steals any scene he's in. I wish he apeared more, but his last scene...dang, it was something out of a horror movie!
Anyway, part of me actually enjoyed this more than Episode VII (I know, sacrilege!) If all the spin-off films are like this, I want Disney to make as much as they want!

 

[wonderfly]

Just got back from watching it.

Hmm. Going to have to process it all. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed it, but...I've got to collect my thoughts. Initial reaction is "Man, that was awesome!" but now I find creeping in "Dang, they reused a lot of stuff from the original trilogy" but I want to fight against that.

a dogfight reminiscent of the Ep. III opening,

No, no, no. Remember - Disney wants to pretend the prequels never happened. That was a tribute to the space battle in Episode VI, I think. Even that scene with the Star Destroyer crashing into another Star Destroyer and falling down onto the shield generator, did that remind anyone else of the Star Destroyer falling into the Death Star in Episode VI?

 

[Spideyzilla]

I think this movie is very reminiscent of Gareth Edwards' last movie, Godzilla. Confident direction, outstanding visuals and cinematography, and an absolutely outstanding climax. From the moment the words "we're Rogue One" are said, this movie is great. Does that mean it's overall a great movie? No. It also falls into the same trap that Godzilla fell into: Edwards just can't seem to direct actors. In fairness to him, he didn't write either movie and he was handcuffed with poorly written characters in both, but there isn't a character in this movie with an ounce of charisma. I like Felicity Jones, but she sucked here, just like every actor (except Bryan Cranston) sucked in Godzilla. The main crew of Rogue One (the group, not the movie) put me to sleep. Remember the character test from Red Letter Media? Where you have to describe a character with only their personality and motivation without mentioning their name, appearance? Every character in this movie fails this test, every single one. Why are they rebels? Why do I get it, the Empire's evil, we know this from the other movies. Why? How does the average person's quality of life decline under the Empire? We know from the other movies that everyone hates the empire, here was their chance to show why. They kind of get into it, but I wanted more. The beginning isn't what I would call boring, but it left something to be desired.

Another problem I had was the villain. Who is this guy? Why is he threatening? He's maybe the lamest Star Wars villain ever. He has no charisma, he's not interesting, and I barely understood what he was up to. Why not just make Darth Vader the main enemy? I know that seems a bit on the nose, but is the movie any better with him not being the main villain? When Vader is in this movie, he steals the show. That attack on the rebel ship was easily one of the top 10 best moments in all of Star Wars as far as I'm concerned. That's how you do an action scene, folks. That was taking advantage of modern technology and techniques to show Vader at his best.

I know I'm trashing it, but I do like the movie as a whole. The movie bends under its flaws, but it never quite breaks. As I said, the second half was outstanding. The final battle somehow found a way to keep getting better and better. It's tense, it's funny, and it's very unique for Star Wars. I wanted a new kind of Star Wars movie, one that felt realer and more like a real war movie, and I got that in spades. I also really liked that

Spoiler

The entire main cast dies. No one on Rogue One survives.

A lot of people may disagree, but I thought it was a super gutsy move. You can't accuse them of playing it safe by doing that, and I applaud them for doing that. I liked the ending, as well. I knew it would lead into A New Hope, but I didn't expect it to end literally five minutes before that movie begins.

Overall, not bad at all. Not as good as Force Awakens, but a fun movie nevertheless. It's easily the best Star Wars prequel, not that that's saying much.

 

[anime_guru]

After watching the movie, it didn't honestly feel like a Star Wars movie in the beginning. The introductory elements of the plot you can literally put in any other movie that's come out within the past five years without anything that makes it unique or distinct. I struggled to see where it was Star Wars - literally looking for anything that yelled 'Okay this is Star Wars'. It took a very long time for me to get to that point.

Then the second part of the movie happened.

Okay, this is starting to look like Star Wars.

And as the filmed progressed in the second half, more and more did the movie feel like Star Wars. And while that buildup for the concept of Star Wars was finally quelled, it took a very LONG TIME to get there.

As a whole, this movie reminds me of the N64 game Shadows of the Empire. Really great concept and overall a slightly above mediocre movie experience. But there were elements of the game that had me questioning why I watched it. I had that feeling in Rogue One.

Part of it lies in the main character. I don't care if she's a girl or something. It's just she wasn't super likable. To be fair, there are loads of reasons why she was brash and I understand her backstory and upbringing ostensibly made her grizzled. But it seems like the character was a struggle. This is definitely the case for me when she

Spoiler

is predictably like meh whatever the force. Before the fight, yeah okay the force is a thing

There wasn't too much buildup into her evolution as a character. I do like how her main objective was handled. But it was hard to slog through the movie because of the motivations of the main character. That's not to say the acting was stellar on many levels, but when the android is arguably the star of the show (with hints of characters we all know and love), it tells me that maybe the charm should've been shared to the three (well two you can argue one more main as far as plot device) leads. At least slightly more charming. The two main characters were just...so...DULL and the story was a bit repetitive. Perhaps my contentions could have less to do with Star Wars and more to do with the exhaustion of movies and characters who have this uber deep destiny without too much in personality.

I am happy to say the secondary characters were truly amazing. I almost wish there was a movie with them alone! Really connected to me (perhaps they embodied my concept of Star Wars in that they represented a rag-tag group of people trying take down the empire). Was truly saddened at the end realizing yep, that happened.

Spoiler

Vader and Tarkin stole the show practically in every scene they were in. Their gravitas brought something so deep to the situation with Vader being menacing and Tarkin being logically ruthless (not inasmuch physically violent). Also an amazing treat.

And of course, the Leia part at the end had me AND the audience going nuts. Tne entire cinema erupted.

All in all, I find the movie like Shadows of the Empire. Great concept, good ideas. Graphics and visuals were just top notch. The main character(s) and motivations were just so...derivative and one dimensional that it was hard for me to get super excited. If the charm from the secondary characters were given to the main character(s), I think this would've been far more enjoyable. Overall, a nice second half but a somewhat slower moving first.

I also would've LOVED to see some more Rebels references.

 

[defunctzombie]

Now that I think about it some more,

Spoiler

what was the point of Forest Whitaker's character other than bringing some star power to the film and rescuing baby Jyn? The rebels built him up to be like a badass Obi-Wan, then when we found him, he basically acted as R2-D2. His noble death scene was even copied nearly to the T with Jyn's.

Was it a case of rebel forces having misinformation, or just story fatigue? Love the actor but the plot really didn't benefit from him. They could have shown us why he was so in demand.

 

[TnAdct1]

Now that I think about it some more,

Spoiler

what was the point of Forest Whitaker's character other than bringing some star power to the film and rescuing baby Jyn? The rebels built him up to be like a badass Obi-Wan, then when we found him, he basically acted as R2-D2. His noble death scene was even copied nearly to the T with Jyn's.

Was it a case of rebel forces having misinformation, or just story fatigue? Love the actor but the plot really didn't benefit from him. They could have shown us why he was so in demand.

One reason is simple:

Spoiler

it helps tie in the Clone Wars animated series (where a younger version of the character first appeared) with the main Star Wars storyline outside of the events that happened between episodes III and IV.

 

[Yojimbo]

One reason is simple:

Spoiler

it helps tie in the Clone Wars animated series (where a younger version of the character first appeared) with the main Star Wars storyline outside of the events that happened between episodes III and IV.

Spoiler

And he's going to show up on Rebels apparently.

 

[defunctzombie]

Spoiler

And he's going to show up on Rebels apparently.

Spoiler

Ah, see I never saw any of the Clone Wars or Rebels material, so I didn't recognize who he was. That's one of the downfalls of this movie; as good as it is, and as much as I think it helps for newbies to watch before A New Hope (if there are any Star Wars newbies left out there), you need to know what Star Wars is to get the movie.

 

[Yojimbo]

Spoiler

Ah, see I never saw any of the Clone Wars or Rebels material, so I didn't recognize who he was. That's one of the downfalls of this movie; as good as it is, and as much as I think it helps for newbies to watch before A New Hope (if there are any Star Wars newbies left out there), you need to know what Star Wars is to get the movie.

Spoiler

I haven't either, I noticed the headline amid all the 'read my Rogue One article' headlines. I think the only animated SW stuff I saw was those Clone Wars shorts Genddy did back in the day.

 

[wonderfly]

....I'm not sure any of that requires spoiler boxes?

Another problem I had was the villain. Who is this guy? Why is he threatening? He's maybe the lamest Star Wars villain ever. He has no charisma, he's not interesting, and I barely understood what he was up to. Why not just make Darth Vader the main enemy?

Actually, I found him a very compelling character. Not menacing, that's for sure, but compelling. The very brief flashback showing him drinking (something alcoholic, I presume) and hanging out with his then friends the Erso family, this is a man who saw the Empire taking over the galaxy and who decided to make a play for power. I kind of felt sorry for him, what with him getting thoroughly pwned (is that still a word?) by both Tarkin and Vader.

People seem to be drooling over Vader's battle sequence, but I wish it could've come sooner in the film. As it's pretty much the last scene, it's an awfully grim sequence to end on for the heroes (and cameo Leia's "Hope" line doesn't redeem the moment). This was supposed to be the first time the Rebel forces experienced a significant victory, instead it felt like a bleak war movie transforming into a horror film in the final sequence. Like "Saving Private Ryan" getting interrupted by Jason Voorhees in "Friday the 13th".

What I did like about Vader: I find it fitting that he turned a portion of Mustafar into a "villain's lair" for when he's not needed. The planet where his greatest defeat occurred is now his resting grounds (probably to remind him to never truly be at rest?). Also: Months and months of speculation about "Who's in the Bacta tank?!? Could it be Supreme Leader Snoke?!?" Nope, it's just Vader, soaking his scars and probably meditating.

 

[Greg91]

I really enjoyed my time with Rogue One: A Star Wars Story. Many people (too many for my taste) like to throw the prequel movies under the bus, but I find there is plenty of good material in them despite their flaws. So this isn't really the first 'good' prequel movie to me. As the first anthology movie, this was a great start.

Unlikely The Force Awakens, I enjoyed the protagonists and antagonists in this film. Jyn Erso is an enjoyable lead as a reluctant member of the Rebellion. Cassian Andor was a strong character because of his troubled past and devotion to the Rebel cause. Chirrut Imwe was possibly my favorite character alongside Jyn. I really did enjoy the other characters but Chirrut's belief in the Force, confidence and impressive combat skills made him an easy character to root for.

While I thought Orson Krennic could have committed some more malicious acts himself instead of being seen taking orders from Tarkin or Vader so much, I thought he did well as an enemy of the Erso family and a firm believer in his cause. Baze Malbus' backstory could've been explained more, but I really liked his laid back gruff attitude and impressive weapons. He and Chirrut were a great team. Bodhi's confidence despite his fear and all the naysayers was quite enjoyable to watch over the course of the movie. K-2SO had some great moments that really proved his contribution to the rebels. And of course he had some humorous moments. Knowing these characters won't return, I'm pleased with what we got, plus there are ways to find out more about them like possibly Rebels, Marvel comics, novels, guides, etc.

I enjoyed Mon Mothma and Bail Organa's roles when they showed up. It was too bad Saw Gerrera didn't quite help in the battle. You could tell he was pretty battle scarred. He definitely seemed to be the reason Jyn got into the rebel cause though and I enjoyed the optimism and determination he had towards fighting the Empire. The quick cameos were great except for the very limited Star Wars Rebels appearances. I wish we 'saw' some stronger connections.

Vader's final scene was pure fan-service that still fit in the story and I loved it! I'm glad he wasn't in this too much because it's not his story. I heard some people say they felt like the Empire won at the end of the movie since Vader went on a killing spree and the main characters died, but I thought this is just the start of the greater rebellion so of course the ending wasn't supposed to fill you with hope. Luke Skywalker ends the threat of the Empire. He's the new hope. Which reminds me, it's kind of funny to think that Luke was hanging out on a farm this whole time when others were fighting for (and losing) their lives.

The story was very poignant with current events in war-torn countries and really made Saw's "Save the Rebellion! Save the dream!" line all the more meaningful. The heroes' end was reminiscent of Revenge of the Sith to me, but not as dark and super emotional for me, which is good because I tear up easy.

Overall, a really great time. The beginning was a bit slow for me, but the story development was needed. As good as The Force Awakens was, this was easily better to me.

Spoiler

Ah, see I never saw any of the Clone Wars or Rebels material, so I didn't recognize who he was. That's one of the downfalls of this movie; as good as it is, and as much as I think it helps for newbies to watch before A New Hope (if there are any Star Wars newbies left out there), you need to know what Star Wars is to get the movie.

Spoiler

I haven't either, I noticed the headline amid all the 'read my Rogue One article' headlines. I think the only animated SW stuff I saw was those Clone Wars shorts Genddy did back in the day.

Spoiler

Both of you need to rectify your erroneous mistakes now! I'm just kidding, but seriously, I don't know why so many people ignore the animated Star Wars content thinking it doesn't matter to the whole saga. Now there's a bunch of spoilers out there for both The Clone Wars and Rebels, but I highly recommend you avoid any more and watch both those shows up to where Rebels is now. You probably won't see it all before Rebels season three returns, but there is some seriously strong, excellent and relevant content in both shows. If you're a Star Wars fan, you simply cannot miss what both of these shows offer. I'm absolutely serious about my recommendation, so please watch them if you care about Star Wars. Obviously you don't need to, but I can not implore you enough. There were even Rebels connections in Rogue One that was likely missed if you haven't seen the show.

 

[Wonderwall]

Saw the CG Leia face...OOOOEEE That is creepy, and not in a good way.

 

[Gold Guy]

People seem to be drooling over Vader's battle sequence, but I wish it could've come sooner in the film. As it's pretty much the last scene, it's an awfully grim sequence to end on for the heroes (and cameo Leia's "Hope" line doesn't redeem the moment). This was supposed to be the first time the Rebel forces experienced a significant victory, instead it felt like a bleak war movie transforming into a horror film in the final sequence. Like "Saving Private Ryan" getting interrupted by Jason Voorhees in "Friday the 13th".

.

See, I really admire that the film went that route and didn't pull any punches; the heroes won, but at great, great cost. Was it grim? Oh yes. But it also worked to show the sacrifice that so many people made in order for the Death Star plans to be made available to the rebels. It didn't shy away from the horror of it. And TBH, after everyone died, I think a happier ending may have felt forced.

 

[Spideyzilla]

Saw the CG Leia face...OOOOEEE That is creepy, and not in a good way.

I think CG Tarkin is way worse, at least Carrie Fisher is still alive. I pose this as an open question, did this movie cross the line? This movie used CGI to "bring back" an actor who's been dead for 22 years. Is this technology gone too far? Did they cross a line here with pretending to bring back Peter Cushing?

 

[wonderfly]

I think CG Tarkin is way worse, at least Carrie Fisher is still alive. I pose this as an open question, did this movie cross the line? This movie used CGI to "bring back" an actor who's been dead for 22 years. Is this technology gone too far? Did they cross a line here with pretending to bring back Peter Cushing?

I hear Disney is being tight lipped about how they pulled this off. It's definitely new special effects territory. Though didn't they do something like this in the Tron movie from 4 or 5 years ago?

I just want to know if they used an actor that was similar in stature/face to Cushing, and from there they let the computers do the rest, or if it was one of those motion capture type suits (like what they did with Gollum in "LotRs") - where they just capture your motions and let computers do the rest. And the voice of Tarkin - was that done by the actor standing there, or did they dub his lines, like what they did for Vader?

EDIT: And what "line" is there to cross? As long as the Cushing estate gets a cut of the money for the appearance, I don't see the problem.