What's wrong with Marvel Animation?

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Freddy

Active Member
"A fan then asked if Marvel Animation has plans for shows and films that have a more adult bent to them -- Wacker and Lane both commented in the affirmative but explained that they have "nothing they can announce right now.""

So I wonder what became of this? Maybe we will get an announcement this year? Part of me wants to believe there are better days ahead but who knows.
Honestly, I don't know how seriously we can take that statement, when they also compared Hulk: Where Monsters Dwell to The Killing Joke.
 

Webbed-Wonder

Still thwipping!
Honestly, I don't know how seriously we can take that statement, when they also compared Hulk: Where Monsters Dwell to The Killing Joke.
That is very true, what a load of baloney that was.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I rather liked the slightly more mature bend for the CGI Spider-Man TNAS show, where it didn't go overboard with its freedom but having that flexibility to not sugarcoat the proceedings was refreshing. IE seeing cops not using lasers, people can get injured/die and talk frankly about it, glass can break, punches can be thrown, feels like there's danger.

I think the Ant-Man and Rocket/Groot shorts Marvel made a few years ago should be brought up, those were my favorite things Marvel animation has made since 2012 personally.
 

Frontier

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Staff member
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Honestly, outside of this website I rarely hear anything about Marvel animation outside of past shows, X-Men, Spider-Man, and Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes.
I sometimes see people talk about them on other sides and social media, but it's not to the extent of the movies or live-action TV shows :ack:.
I think people, fans and showrunners, forget that people only really like shared universes when the actual content is good. People don't like or care about shared universes for their own sake.
Just look at every failed attempt at a shared universe in the past few years :sweat:.
Maybe I'm in the minority but I rather liked the slightly more mature bend for the CGI Spider-Man TNAS show, where it didn't go overboard with its freedom but having that flexibility to not sugarcoat the proceedings was refreshing. IE seeing cops not using lasers, people can get injured/die and talk frankly about it, glass can break, punches can be thrown, feels like there's danger.
Y'know, I honestly wonder what a modern, all-CGI, Marvel cartoon would look like in an era where we've had Green Lantern: The Animated Series, Beware the Batman, Transformers Prime, and TMNT 2K12 come out, even if they're not as in fashion now as they were a few years ago.
 

SweetShop209

Well-Known Member
1. I sometimes see people talk about them on other sides and social media, but it's not to the extent of the movies or live-action TV shows :ack:.

2. Just look at every failed attempt at a shared universe in the past few years :sweat:.

3. Y'know, I honestly wonder what a modern, all-CGI, Marvel cartoon would look like in an era where we've had Green Lantern: The Animated Series, Beware the Batman, Transformers Prime, and TMNT 2K12 come out, even if they're not as in fashion now as they were a few years ago.
1. It does seem to be the thing where most of Marvel Animation, even the most acclaimed projects, tends to have more of a niche audience outside the website.

2. I'd say its partially because, besides Stan Lee and Joe Quesada, there's no long lasting Marvel equivalent of someone like Bruce Timm or James Tucker or Jim Krieg. I mean, yeah Paul Dini was involved with Ultimate Spiderman and the 2013 Hulk series, but he was only involved in three seasons of the former and the latter was cancelled after two seasons. The closest to Marvel equivalents would be Christopher Yost and Greg Johnson, but the former hasn't been involved since the end of Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes with his only animated project since then being Star Wars Rebels, while the latter's last Marvel project was the 2011 DVD Thor movie , and his works since then skewing younger (Transformers Rescue Bots , and later on, Miles From Tomorrowland and The Rocketeer on Disney Junior).

3. It would definitely be interesting since, outside of Disney Junior shows, Disney's only CGI cartoons from the past 10-15 years are with Star Wars and that Tron series.
 

Frontier

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Regardless of how we feel, the shows make $$$. Ultimate Spiderman literally paid for it's own fourth season.
Kinda makes you think though...Assemble has basically had five seasons, and Guardians three seasons so does that mean it did very well? Especially since I've been under the assumption that the Spider-Man cartoons are the only shows that really do well rating-wise :confused:.
1. It does seem to be the thing where most of Marvel Animation, even the most acclaimed projects, tends to have more of a niche audience outside the website.
I would wonder whether it's a Disney XD thing, but it doesn't seem to effect the Star Wars cartoons, or something like Gravity Falls.
2. I'd say its partially because, besides Stan Lee and Joe Quesada, there's no long lasting Marvel equivalent of someone like Bruce Timm or James Tucker or Jim Krieg. I mean, yeah Paul Dini was involved with Ultimate Spiderman and the 2013 Hulk series, but he was only involved in three seasons of the former and the latter was cancelled after two seasons. The closest to Marvel equivalents would be Christopher Yost and Greg Johnson, but the former hasn't been involved since the end of Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes with his only animated project since then being Star Wars Rebels, while the latter's last Marvel project was the 2011 DVD Thor movie , and his works since then skewing younger (Transformers Rescue Bots , and later on, Miles From Tomorrowland and The Rocketeer on Disney Junior).
I miss Josh Fine :(.
 

SweetShop209

Well-Known Member
I would wonder whether it's a Disney XD thing, but it doesn't seem to effect the Star Wars cartoons, or something like Gravity Falls.
Marvel has not really had the best hold when it comes to animation, regardless of network. I mean, you'll see endless theories and thesis papers on how great shows like Batman The Animated Series or Young Justice are, analyzing the ins and outs of various elements, yet even the most acclaimed Marvel animated projects don't have that level of dedication, at least one that vocal.
 

Frontier

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Marvel has not really had the best hold when it comes to animation, regardless of network. I mean, you'll see endless theories and thesis papers on how great shows like Batman The Animated Series or Young Justice are, analyzing the ins and outs of various elements, yet even the most acclaimed Marvel animated projects don't have that level of dedication, at least one that vocal.
I mean, I think you do for some projects, like Spectacular Spider-Man for one, and I see a lot of people who still talk about the X-Men shows and Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes.
 

SweetShop209

Well-Known Member
I mean, I think you do for some projects, like Spectacular Spider-Man for one, and I see a lot of people who still talk about the X-Men shows and Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes.
Its primarily on this site, a few boards, and a few odd videos here and there on YouTube. Not much else.
 

Rick Jones

fan-man
Staff member
Moderator
Marvel has not really had the best hold when it comes to animation, regardless of network. I mean, you'll see endless theories and thesis papers on how great shows like Batman The Animated Series or Young Justice are, analyzing the ins and outs of various elements, yet even the most acclaimed Marvel animated projects don't have that level of dedication, at least one that vocal.
I kind of blame Marvel for some of the lack of pop culture love for their old shows. Shows like Spider-Man 67, Amazing Friends, X-Men 92, Spider-Man TAS, X-Men Evolution, etc, had immense fanbases but Marvel usually treats their old cartoons like something more disposable and replaceable that Warner Bros did. From my perspective, Warner Bros. kind of helps keep the fandom of the old stuff alive and are able to capitalize from that in return.
 

Webbed-Wonder

Still thwipping!
I kind of blame Marvel for some of the lack of pop culture love for their old shows. Shows like Spider-Man 67, Amazing Friends, X-Men 92, Spider-Man TAS, X-Men Evolution, etc, had immense fanbases but Marvel usually treats their old cartoons like something more disposable and replaceable that Warner Bros did. From my perspective, Warner Bros. kind of helps keep the fandom of the old stuff alive and are able to capitalize from that in return.
Absolutely, it does feel that way a lot of the time. Like if it's not the current thing it's disposable and out of sight completely.

Kinda like how when Marvel/Disney started airing their own new shows (Ultimate and Avengers Assemble) and shelved reruns of the old cartoons that were frequently on the channel for years (Spider-Man TAS, X-Men TAS, X-Men Evolution, Amazing Friends, Fantastic Four, Silver Surfer, Iron Man). I actually recently saw a shirt at a store- Box Lunch, kinda their whole thing is high priced shirts/merch for nostalgic/hot properties, but they had a new officially licensed Spider-Man TAS shirt and I jumped on it instantly.
 

Frontier

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Absolutely, it does feel that way a lot of the time. Like if it's not the current thing it's disposable and out of sight completely.

Kinda like how when Marvel/Disney started airing their own new shows (Ultimate and Avengers Assemble) and shelved reruns of the old cartoons that were frequently on the channel for years (Spider-Man TAS, X-Men TAS, X-Men Evolution, Amazing Friends, Fantastic Four, Silver Surfer, Iron Man). I actually recently saw a shirt at a store- Box Lunch, kinda their whole thing is high priced shirts/merch for nostalgic/hot properties, but they had a new officially licensed Spider-Man TAS shirt and I jumped on it instantly.
Y'know, this reminds me that they've started posing episodes of Fantastic Four: World's Greatest Heroes on the Marvel HQ Youtube channel, which really surprised me...both because it's an older show, even pre-Disney, and that it was something FF related :eek:.
 

Webbed-Wonder

Still thwipping!
Y'know, this reminds me that they've started posing episodes of Fantastic Four: World's Greatest Heroes on the Marvel HQ Youtube channel, which really surprised me...both because it's an older show, even pre-Disney, and that it was something FF related :eek:.
That was indeed a nice surprise! I actually liked that show, and I'm glad to see it unearthed. I wonder if they might do the same thing with X-Men some point soon and start rereleasing episodes of Wolverine and The X-Men online again, or Evolution.
 

wonderfly

Is this the future?!?
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....has there been an attempt by any of these cartoons to place them in the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

I mean, the Netflix Marvel shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the ABC Marvel Shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the Hulu shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe...

Wouldn't that be the way for a Marvel cartoon to generate some buzz, to be tied in with the Marvel movies?
 

Frontier

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That was indeed a nice surprise! I actually liked that show, and I'm glad to see it unearthed. I wonder if they might do the same thing with X-Men some point soon and start rereleasing episodes of Wolverine and The X-Men online again, or Evolution.
I was wondering the same thing. I think Evolution used to be online on Marvel's old Youtube channel, if I recall correctly :).
....has there been an attempt by any of these cartoons to place them in the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

I mean, the Netflix Marvel shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the ABC Marvel Shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the Hulu shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe...

Wouldn't that be the way for a Marvel cartoon to generate some buzz, to be tied in with the Marvel movies?
Well, I think that's probably some of the intention by having the character designs and characterizations mimic the movies to such an extent, even if logistically I don't think it would ever actually work to have them be in-continuity with the MCU.
 

SweetShop209

Well-Known Member
I do want to point out that only the first 2 seasons of Avengers Assemble are uploaded to Marvel HQ, so there's most likely a limit as to how many episodes are on there.

....has there been an attempt by any of these cartoons to place them in the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

I mean, the Netflix Marvel shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the ABC Marvel Shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the Hulu shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe...

Wouldn't that be the way for a Marvel cartoon to generate some buzz, to be tied in with the Marvel movies?
Not currently, but I heard that Spider Man: The New Animated Series tried tying itself, albeit loosely, to the Sam Raimi films.
 

Red Arrow

ça va nog wel
....has there been an attempt by any of these cartoons to place them in the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

I mean, the Netflix Marvel shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the ABC Marvel Shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe, the Hulu shows exist in the Marvel cinematic universe...

Wouldn't that be the way for a Marvel cartoon to generate some buzz, to be tied in with the Marvel movies?
I have heard that the problem with Avengers Assemble was that it tried too much to look like the movies by repeating the same jokes forever and using the same designs.

I also don't see how bad writing can be compensated by setting the story in some continuity.
 

Frontier

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I do want to point out that only the first 2 seasons of Avengers Assemble are uploaded to Marvel HQ, so there's most likely a limit as to how many episodes are on there.
I imagine there might also be a timing issue. They might start putting in later and more current seasons in the future once they've finished airing :).
Not currently, but I heard that Spider Man: The New Animated Series tried tying itself, albeit loosely, to the Sam Raimi films.
Yeah, it's why they couldn't use a lot of the major Spider-Man villains at first because they didn't want to encroach on what the movies were doing :ack:.
 

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