The TPP... On the verge of happening

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I.R. Shokew

HAIL NEO ARCADIA!
Sep 26, 2011
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Everyone should be scared of this - EVERYONE who ain't rich or well off. AT ALL.


To those interested, skip to the 1 - hour mark. It sums up things perfectly. And why I (and you) should be ANGRY and VIOLENT about THIS.

This is dystopian in every way possible. And should be treated as such.
 

Spideyzilla

Moderator
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Jul 23, 2008
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One thing that's been a topic of discussion here in Canada is that it will introduce milk from other countries that could hurt our farmers. Just the other other day we heard that this milk could contain chemicals and pesticides that are banned in Canada, but legal elsewhere. That's one example of the ramifications of this, but it's alarming. This is a deal so bad that its details have been kept top secret, even though it's supposed to benefit us, the people. It disturbs me that our new Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau, seems to have no real opinion on this. He's vowed to hold an open discussion on it with Canadians, but also said good things about it. I don't know what to think. This is deeply troubling.
 

I.R. Shokew

HAIL NEO ARCADIA!
Sep 26, 2011
10,334
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113
Neo Arcadia, USA

I.R. Shokew

HAIL NEO ARCADIA!
Sep 26, 2011
10,334
0
113
Neo Arcadia, USA
Further proof that the TPP is bad...
  • Article 18, Section J smells disturbingly like a zombie-SOPA: it requires Internet service providers to play “copyright cops” and take down websites, even without a court order, and rewards them with sweeping legal immunity when they comply.

  • Article 18.63 demands that TPP member countries enforce copyright terms 70 YEARS AFTER THE DEATH OF THE CREATOR, even though there’s no evidence that these draconian term lengths benefit content creators. This will keep so much information, art, and creativity out of the public domain for decades longer than necessary, and open the floodgates for copyright-based censorship. Oh, and at the same time, doesn’t export the only good part of US copyright policy — Fair Use provisions.

  • Article 18.68 broadly criminalizes circumventing any and all Digital Rights Management (DRM) even on a device that you own for a legitimate purpose. This could make it illegal to unlock your phone or modify a computer so that you could use Linux, for example.

  • Article 18.78 on “Trade Secrets” is so broad that it endangers whistleblowers and journalists by criminalizing “unauthorized and willful disclosure of a trade secret including via a computer system.”

  • Article 9 on Investor-State Dispute Settlement will allow copyright holders who benefit from that incredibly extended copyright term to sue governments they don’t think are doing enough to protect their copyright — or enough to punish user
And here's a newstory link re-confirming why this is bad...
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/nov/06/clock-ticking-time-bomb-blow-up-free-internet-tpp?t=dXNlcmlkPTU0NDM3ODMxLGVtYWlsaWQ9MTAwNzQ=

This comment sums up my thoughts perfectly.....
"No longer is it enough to increase sales by offering a product, why do that when you could merge with a rival to monopolise a market. If your company deals on harmful products: fast food, tobacco and alcohol you would make every effort to increase your market even at the expense of the public. To stop the public learning the harms of what you sell you must control the media industry as well. When you become a company large enough to control all that you must now lobby politicians for the cause of your company, if money doesn't convince them your media will ensure that they don't matter any way. When the media the public gets is no longer just a paper you control but online from each other you must crush and censor anyone who goes against your interests and ensure future generations are educated in schools your company controls so they conform in future.

Now if you control the banks and the military, you can take wealth not by growth, but by robbery and destruction all the while you claim to be helping create the economy and defeat "terror". And they'll believe you, and with TPP you can now sensor those who don't.

When your corporation and a few others have all that you have complete control, a fascist system without anyone even noticing, anyone that matters that is."
 

sun

You stay, I go
Aug 11, 2001
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This is not a good law, it will send jobs overseas. Further it will as said, monopolize many industries and give the corporations even more control over our lives..
 

I.R. Shokew

HAIL NEO ARCADIA!
Sep 26, 2011
10,334
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113
Neo Arcadia, USA
Thi BUMP was essential - for anyone who is interested.

Here's a full-on reading of what's in the TPP, courtesy of Youtube user and hero, Sargon of Akkad (in 5, long, painful, essential parts!):

 

stephane dumas

Well-Known Member
Apr 23, 2006
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Canada
Sorry for the bump, but I saw this article from ZeroHedge about the TPP. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-01-23/obamatrade-will-cost-448000-american-jobs-new-study-finds Here an exterpt of that article.

Submitted by Derrick Broze via TheAntiMedia.org,

One of the major purported selling points for the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) is a supposed increase in new jobs as a result of the controversial trade deal. The deal involves 12 nations, including the U.S., Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Japan, Malaysia and more. However, two recent economic reports have contradicted the claims that jobs will increase. They have shown that, more than likely, the deal will lead to a loss of jobs.

First there was a World Bank report that predicted that TPP would produce negligible boosts to the economies of the U.S., Australia, and Canada. TechDirt writes:

So according to the World Bank’s figures, the U.S. will gain an extra 0.04% GDP per year on average, as a result of TPP; Australia an extra 0.07% annually, and Canada a boost of 0.12% per year.”

This study was followed up by a review from Jerome Capaldo and Alex Izurieta at Tufts University. In a study titled “Trading Down: Unemployment, Inequality and Other Risks of the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement,” Capaldo and Izurieta claim their study uses a more realistic model than past analyses. Specifically, the researchers state that their model incorporates effects on employment that were previously excluded from TPP calculations.

Their study found that economic growth is likely to be limited — and negative — for some countries, including the United States. The researchers also found the TPP would probably lead to increased unemployment and inequality. Capaldo and Izurieta explained:

“The standard model assumes full employment and invariant income distribution, ruling out the main risks of trade and financial liberalization. Subject to these assumptions, it finds positive effects on growth. An important question, therefore, is how this conclusion changes if those assumptions are dropped.”

In the paper, the two researchers state that changes in GDP growth are “mostly projected to be negligible. After using two sets of growth figures, ten-year measurements, and annual averages, they concluded the TPP “appears to only marginally change competitiveness among participating countries. Most gains are therefore obtained at the expense of non-TPP countries.”

The fact that any gains — however negligible — will come at the cost of non-TPP countries should be a warning to all nations of the world, especially those who do not stand to benefit from the agreement. Concerning predictions of actual job losses or gains, the researchers write,TPP would lead to employment losses in all countries, with a total of 771,000 lost jobs. The United States would be the hardest hit, with a loss of 448,000 jobs.

Finally, the researchers draw harrowing conclusions about the end result of the TPP.

“Globally, the TPP favors competition on labor costs and remuneration of capital. Depending on the policy choices in non-TPP countries, this may accelerate the global race to the bottom, increasing downward pressure on labor incomes in a quest for ever more elusive trade gains.”

This latest analysis of TPP job claims is even more dismal than a February 2015 analysis by the Washington Post, which revealed the U.S. government’s numbers on expected job increases from the TPP are not factually correct. The Post’s Fact Checker examined several quotes from government officials, including Secretary of State John Kerry and Secretary of Agriculture Tom Vilsack. Both Kerry and Vilsack claimed the international trade agreement would create 650,000 new jobs. However, these numbers do not take into account income gains and changing wages. According to the government’s own sources, imports and exports would increase by the same amount — resulting in a net number of zero new jobs.

The TPP has faced criticism for several years, not least because it has been negotiated in secret with overwhelming influence from multinational corporations. In late June 2015, President Obama signed into law the so-called “fast-track” bill, which set the stage for approval of the TPP. “Fast-track” limits Congress’ ability to alter the provisions of the trade deal, and only allows a vote of yes or no. The final terms of the deal were agreed upon in October 2015, and the full text of the agreement was released in November. The earliest Obama can sign the deal is February 4, 2016.
 

stephane dumas

Well-Known Member
Apr 23, 2006
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I should had posted on the 2016 Presidential elections but since the main part is about the TPP I thought to post it here.
http://www.infowars.com/msnbc-censors-sanders-condemning-tpp/
MSNBC cut away from live coverage of a Bernie Sanders press conference once he began to condemn the controversial Trans-Pacific Partnership.

Social media exploded as a result as viewers felt the break in Monday’s coverage was due to MSNBC’s owner, Comcast, not wanting to air criticism of the TPP because it benefits greatly from the treaty.
Scroll to the 1:40 mark.
 

Fone Bone

Matt Zimmer
Jan 19, 2004
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That's Trump. Principles a foot wide and an inch deep.

That being said, I never got what the big deal was over it. If this was literally the worst thing Trump ever did I wouldn't have any beef with him.
 

Dreyfus

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Oct 18, 2009
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Trump hasn't done anything yet that would have the lasting damage to American workers and the middle class than the passage of the TPP, or for that matter, NAFTA, has had, at least that I can think of. Actually, no, other than opting out of the Paris Climate Accords. If he doesn't even follow through with his promise on this issue, everyone should see he is a liar, even his supporters. In my opinion, Globalism is a race to the bottom at the expense of the worker and consumers.
 
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Fone Bone

Matt Zimmer
Jan 19, 2004
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Trump hasn't done anything yet that would have the lasting damage to American workers and the middle class than the passage of the TPP, or for that matter, NAFTA, has had, at least that I can think of. Actually, no, other than opting out of the Paris Climate Accords. If he doesn't even follow through with his promise on this issue, everyone should see he is a liar, even his supporters. In my opinion, Globalism is a race to the bottom at the expense of the worker and consumers.
You aren't wrong about how much globalism sucks, but you are wrong about how much it sucks compared to Trump. Trump may not have done as much damage to the American worker as TPP would, but he's definitely done more damage to America itself. The judiciary alone will be crippled for decades, and he's turned us all against each other. The government is now unfathomably corrupt, and we are hated pretty much everywhere but Russia. We have a hostile foreign power controlling our government, and a good 40% of Americans approve of that. We have not been in this bad of a spot since the Civil War era. The TPP doesn't rate to me compared to that.

For what it's worth, I don't have the link handy, but it turns out Trump fully walked back this idea, which again speaks to his schizophrenic nature, and the fact that you can't believe a thing he says. Which is something that is NOT normal and should never be normalized.
 

Dreyfus

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2009
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I'm no fan of Trump, but I do not believe he has done any lasting damage to the country (Paris Accords aside). On the contrary, I think his election was a natural reaction against the corruption that already existed in Washington and that has been going on for decades, under Reagan, the Bushes, Clinton, and Obama. The government has been corrupted by monied interests and puppet lawmakers long before Trump came along. Who pushed NAFTA through? Bill Clinton. Who would have pushed the TPP through? Obama and Hillary Clinton. Honestly, Hillary would have just been more of the same. Trump sucks, but at least with him here now, we see more clearly what we're dealing with and can now respond accordingly. That is the first step toward real change.
 

Fone Bone

Matt Zimmer
Jan 19, 2004
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I'm no fan of Trump, but I do not believe he has done any lasting damage to the country (Paris Accords aside). On the contrary, I think his election was a natural reaction against the corruption that already existed in Washington and that has been going on for decades, under Reagan, the Bushes, Clinton, and Obama. The government has been corrupted by monied interests and puppet lawmakers long before Trump came along. Who pushed NAFTA through? Bill Clinton. Who would have pushed the TPP through? Obama and Hillary Clinton. Honestly, Hillary would have just been more of the same. Trump sucks, but at least with him here now, we see more clearly what we're dealing with and can now respond accordingly. That is the first step toward real change.
He literally just called the former director of the FBI a "slimeball" on Twitter a couple of days ago. Don't normalize the damage he has done to this great country of ours.

Edit:

Oh, crap, I just realized this post made it sound like I'm sticking up for the FBI. I'm not. I'm just pointing out how unpresidential Shart Garfunkle is.
 

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