"The Flash (2014)" Season Five Talkback (Spoilers)

[Road to Gotham]

The Rag Doll is a creepy addition to the Flash's tv gallery of rogues.
Hope he appears again.

The original RAG DOLL was created by Gardner Fox and Lou Ferstadt for FLASH COMICS #36.
I 1st saw him in JUSTICE LEAGUE OF AMERICA #195-197 as a member of the Secret Society of Super Villains in the annual JLA/JSA crossover.

 

[The Penguin]

Be thankful for new Flash! Tonight at 8 p.m. ET on The CW.

"The Icicle Cometh"
Tuesday, November 20, 2018 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
Caitlin, Barry and Cisco learn something new about Caitlin’s father.

 

[hobbyfan]

Icicle is a villain more closely associated with the Golden Age Green Lantern and/or Justice Society. Thomas Snow faked his death, but then, since the coroner was named Cameron Mahkent, one assumes that Snow was the alias, and that Mahkent, like Eobard Thawne/Harrison Wells in season 1, took over the Thomas Snow identity.

In case you wonder about Cicada's latest victim, that would be Razorsharp, a character introduced in the books in 1991 in the Bloodlines event. She was killed in the books about a decade or so ago.

 

[Fone Bone]

The Flash “The Icicle Cometh”

I question why they are turning Cecile into such a hot mess. Granted, she wasn’t the most interesting character before they did that, but it’s kind of disturbing that’s the place their mind went.

That last scene with Cicada was beyond creepy.

Cecile is right that the thing with Ralph’s nose is gross. What she doesn’t realize is that her crazy behavior is exactly as gross.

Icicle, huh? Interesting origin and Victor Fries shout-out. Also glad that not only did Killer Frost come back, but that it wasn’t considered a bad thing.

No clue what Welles was doing when he was drinking tea and singing that song. That was bizarre.

A decent week, although nothing to write home about. ***1/2.

 

[Yojimbo]

Icicle, huh? Interesting origin and Victor Fries shout-out. Also glad that not only did Killer Frost come back, but that it wasn’t considered a bad thing.

And a shout out to Louise Lincoln, who was another of the Killer Frosts in the comics. Plus, the Fries mention... can't help but wonder if that's going to come into play in the crossover since

Spoiler

we know his wife at least will be appearing.

 

[TnAdct1]

I question why they are turning Cecile into such a hot mess. Granted, she wasn’t the most interesting character before they did that, but it’s kind of disturbing that’s the place their mind went.

I think part of the reason is because the actor playing Joe West is going to be out for a while due to back injury, with her filling in for him.

 

[The Penguin]

Adeste Fideles! Tonight at 8 p.m. ET on The CW.

"O Come, All Ye Thankful"
Tuesday, November 27, 2018 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
While Nora grapples with unresolved anger over her father’s disappearance in the future, Barry and Team Flash must stop a powerful new meta.

 

[Road to Gotham]

Nice Seeing the Weather Wizard again even if he didn't do anything.
The show gave the Weather Witch a complete upgrade over her comic book counterpart who was just cannon fodder.


'The Flash': Who is the Weather Witch?

 

[Fone Bone]

The Flash “O Come, All Ye Thankful”

That was fine. No real complaints.

I mean, I suppose I could gripe about how unlikely is was that the mission lined up with the personal drama between Barry and Nora so perfectly, but that’s ALL television. And to be blunt, even if that is a bit clumsily written, and maybe Nora’s forgiveness at the end is a bit random and trite, that is not actually a trope I object to. I have always preferred wrap-up to realism in my stories, so I’ll take a corny, unearned, happy ending over everyone ending the episode sullen and miserable any day of the week. Every time. It’s why this show is better than Arrow in the first place.

The special effects in the climax were amazing. It’s been awhile since the show has done stuff like that, but I think back at how amazed I was at the action scenes every week in season 1, and am a little disappointed how relatively rare they became after that. They seemed to have a huge budget in season 1, and had to scale back in every season past that. Ralph Dibney is NOT the only character and concept who has suffered for it. Not by a longshot. Still, it was fun to just watch a scene and say, “Neat!” again.

I love that when Caitlin called Joss “Weather Witch” Cisco’s exact words are, “I’ll allow it.” I don’t know WHY I thought that was so fabulous and funny, but it was.

And yeah, Thanksgiving isn’t actually about giving thanks. It’s about eating good food and spending time with people you hopefully care about. Killer Frost is right that those suckers were over(or rather under)thinking it. And yeah, eating too much food is not just a holiday thing for Americans. We eat to excess EVERY day. Insightful line from Sherloque there.

What do I think of Cicada’s backstory? Honestly, it makes me LESS sympathetic if anything. He was always sort of a scumbag, and him not being so for one year of his life doesn’t justify anything he’s done. I’d believe he was doing it all for Gracie easier if he hadn’t said “I don’t want this kid,” (which she heard, that monster) the first day she arrived after her parents died, and then he immediately proceeded to feed her days old Chinese food for breakfast and made her cry. He sucks.

For the record, when everybody is held to account for Cicada’s crimes, that doctor who is covering for him deserves to spend the rest of her life in prison for multiple first degree murders. She literally knows he’s a serial killer, and is covering for him because she believes he’s killing the right people.

Also, it’s refreshing that they figured out who Cicada is already. Because he went unidentified in the original timeline, so this means changing the future for the better is not as hard as Savitar was making it seem.

Next week looks to be a killer episode. All in.

Good week. ****.

 

[The Penguin]

The Flash number 100! Right now on The CW.

"What's Past is Prologue"
Tuesday, December 4, 2018 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
In the 100th episode, Barry and Team Flash come up with a plan to stop Cicada.

 

[Road to Gotham]

Directed by Tom Cavanagh and it great seeing him again as Wells/Eobard Thawne.

Nora keeping secrets. Thats not going to end well.
She also name drops "LEGION" but doesn't say the whole group name.

 

[hobbyfan]

Directed by Tom Cavanagh and it great seeing him again as Wells/Eobard Thawne.

Nora keeping secrets. Thats not going to end well.
She also name drops "LEGION" but doesn't say the whole group name.

Well, XS is/was a member of the Legion of Superheroes in the books.

 

[Yojimbo]

Could Sherloque be another Eobard?

 

[Fone Bone]

He's too goofy for that to be acceptable to me.

The Flash “What’s Past Is Prologue”

That was a 100th episode all right.

It strikes me as VERY weird that this episode kicked the amount of butt that it did while Arrow’s 100th a couple of seasons back was so underwhelming. I mean, yeah, it unfortunately occurred during a mediocre “crossover event” but maybe if Invasion had been any good, that episode would have been too. As it stands I’m a little appalled that they pulled out all of the stops for this, while Arrow’s 100th episode wasn’t even ABOUT Green Arrow. Oh well.

Lots of cameos and goodies to dig into. Tom Cavanaugh goes back to his evil performance as Thawne like wearing a glove, and the same it true for his performance as a rattled Harry. We also got Zoom, and Savitar, and brief cameos for Grodd, Devoe, Ronnie, and Henry Allen.

The question isn’t actually why Ralph is playing “Back In Time”. The question is why no-one else previously thought to do that. That was an awesome ballad to see speed effects against. I would not mind if Ralph made that thing a running gag.

Love the stuff with Sherloque and the diary. We don’t quite know what’s going on, and because of Thawne at the end, we still don’t, but the looks on Sherloque’s face say he is either up to something secretly nefarious, or he correctly suspects Nora is. It’s probably the second thing, but the genius thing is they don’t outright say for sure, and it plays either way. But Nora is probably the one being sneaky. And if she IS working with Thawne for some common goal, she’s not going to like what she learned tonight. She’s not gonna like it at all.

Why didn’t Thawne recognize her in the past? Harrison Welles was the end stage of his life and timeline. Or did he recognize her and was playing dumb? Another unanswered question.

If Killer Frost is not effected by Cicada’s dagger, the season is already half won. In fact, the entire premise of the episode is why I like this specific show. The characters come up with some insane plan, talk themselves into going through with it, and then it somehow crazily works. Now, they didn’t actually catch Cicada tonight. But they got a LOT closer than they ever did in the original timeline.

Great episode tonight. Usually The Flash is the Arrowverse show that blows it after the winter break, but I hope that’s not true this year. This has been a good season so far and this was a great episode. *****.

 

[Yojimbo]

If Killer Frost is not effected by Cicada’s dagger, the season is already half won. In fact, the entire premise of the episode is why I like this specific show. The characters come up with some insane plan, talk themselves into going through with it, and then it somehow crazily works. Now, they didn’t actually catch Cicada tonight. But they got a LOT closer than they ever did in the original timeline.

Yeah, so any in theory metahumans who existed before any of the show's incident would be crucial against Cicada. Or even someone like the Ray. <cough>

 

[hobbyfan]

This was weak in a lot of places.

I think most of us were deluded into assuming that Cicada would be a short-term big bad, but nope. Just when you think they finally figured things out, they decide to go back to stringing out the plot for five more months because they're too stupid to see that Cicada has no value as a full-season villain.

Also, while Cicada's original comics alter-ego, David Hersch, was used earlier in the season, they decided that Orlin Dwyer would be Cicada here, a made-for-TV character with no backstory. Whatever. Comes across as another emo.

SO not digging Nora being in league with Thawne. We know she's naive, letting her need to see her father alive override all common sense. This will not end well.

 

[The Penguin]

Crossover part one, existing in a world where The Flash airs on Sunday and Supergirl airs on Tuesday.

"Elseworlds, Part 1"
Sunday, December 9, 2018 @ 8 p.m. ET/7 CT on The CW
.

 

[Fone Bone]

The Flash “Elseworlds: Part One”

At several points this season I considered temporarily ducking out of Supergirl, and permanently ducking out of Arrow. Amazing crossovers like this one are why I probably never will. My only prayer is that those shows actually get better. Because I needed the subtext for this episode that watching those two shows provided. I would not understand Supergirl’s drama with the President, or why Oliver was in prison, and why his marriage is rocky. And maybe it seems foolish to watch two crappy shows to make three or four episodes a year amazing, but this was a heck of an amazing episode, so I’m reluctant to change my mind. I probably enjoyed this episode more than people who ducked out of Arrow and Supergirl because they now suck. And that matters to me, when everything else is said and done.

Speaking of amazing, I love Amazo. I like the idea that as a robot they needed to shut him off, but I kind of feel like that simple solution doesn’t really count when they exploded him instead. For the record, Cisco keeping the souvenir is gonna backfire in the future. Bank on it. And Superman probably won’t be around when he DOES reconstruct himself.

I was under the impression that there would be a Smallville connection via the Multiverse, but for some reason, just hearing the theme song “Save Me” will suffice. Part of me is disappointed that the show hasn’t figured out a way to make that Earth Arrowverse canon yet. But the theme song is all I needed tonight.

We didn’t see enough Batwoman and 1990 Flash for my liking this episode. I bet they are the focus of the next episode, and Clark comes back for the grand finale.

For the record, Deegan is nuts. There is a reason those other psychiatrists were openly mocking him (which is pretty much a total no-no, especially in public). But that is a level of quack that NEEDS to be publicly rebuked in front of other witnesses, particularly if those witnesses are also shrinks. It was completely unprofessional that woman said what she did. But Deegan is such a nutjob she actually needed to publicly shame him for his foolish and dangerous ideas. I’m wondering why no-one ever thought to do that with Ben Lockwood on Supergirl. He’s treated as the other side of the equation, instead of the genocidal lunatic he clearly is. Speak up against fascism before it is too late. It’s a lesson our Earth is being forced to learn over and over again. That female psychiatrist is now my new TV queen. And we never even learned her name!

I love that Barry is actually excited he’s Green Arrow, and impressed with what he can do. I loved Lois rooting for Barry to punch Oliver because she can instantly tell he’s a jerk. What bothers me the most about the “lessons” Oliver tries to teach Barry is that Oliver is a crap teacher. As far as X-S or Elongated Man are concerned, Barry is a real-live role model overflowing with wisdom. Oliver keeps trying to teach people the same lessons he learned in the Bratva. Except the lessons clearly never worked on him, and they would never work in a million years on people who hadn’t suffered as much as he did. Anatole and Nyssa’s lessons only “helped” Oliver because he was a completely broken person. Oliver expected those same things to work with Team Arrow, and then Artemis defected, Wilddog, Black Canary, and Mr. Terrific ditched him because he was such a jerk, and finally Dig left. And then he wound up in prison. Why should anyone want to follow Oliver’s insights in a million years? Everyone who works with him can’t stand him. Yeah, Oliver saves people’s lives. But that’s his only virtue. His personal relationships (notably save the late Quentin Lance) are worse for having him in their lives, and his tactics and methods would only ever work for him. Even Batman would never shoot Robin in the back with arrows to teach him a lesson. Only a completely broken person would think anyone could ever learn something from that.

Why is he so mad Barry thought it was funny? That was the right reaction. He’s upset because he supposedly did it to Barry to “help” him, and Barry did it to prank him. But there is nobody that would actually help. The idea is ridiculous on its face. Barry mocking it and laughing is the correct response. It’s asinine in real-time.

I love Barry refusing to dislocate his thumb. Until Oliver explains his body had been through enough training and punishment to be able to do it on command, I would never do it in a million years either. And Oliver’s explanation still sounds a little crazy.

I like the first time Barry wants to go back is when he learns Oliver woke up in his and Iris’ bed. Not cool, man! That’s a dude’s wife and bed! We’ve gotta fix this!

I love that Sherloque has Superman deliver a check to his ex-wife on Earth-38, and Superman is a bit mortified by that notion too. For the record, Sherloque probably should have questioned whether or not Clark could be trusted BEFORE he handed off the check, not after he’s already left. Sherloque is not as smart as advertised.

I have never liked Elizabeth “Bitsie” Tulloch, who was the weakest cast member on Grimm, but I expected she’d be able to pull off a serviceable job as Lois. Juliet worked in the first two or three seasons of Grimm because she was a light character, who didn’t go through too much bad stuff. It’s only when they added trauma and pathos to the character that I learned how one-note of an actress Tulloch actually is. Unless they turn Lois into a murderous Hexenbiest who kills Ma Kent and sleeps with Lex Luthor, I don’t see the character giving her too much trouble, even if she lacks range for literally everything else.

Amazing first part to the crossover. *****.

 

[Yojimbo]

That was amazing! If only they put the effort in all episodes but the crossover has become a special tradition. Glad they kept AMAZO a secret or I didn't see the spoiler, it was a genuine surprise for me and man, so epic. (Kinda makes me wonder if that robot in the Ray animated DTV was a Ivo-ARGUS prototype, too)

All those callbacks, it was a good move to focus on Oliver and Barry even down to the arrows in the back from Flash season 1. And they even addressed where the toilet is in the Pipeline cells, lmao. Totally loved how they reacted to each other's abilities.

Yeah, come on Cisco - saving the Samuroid head didn't weigh too much on you so you're gonna keep a piece of AMAZO around. That can't be leading to anything good.

I was pretty stoked to see Superman interact with Earth-1. And to cap it off, they used "a friend" line -- totally from the Reeves movies right? And Oliver puffing his chest, lmao.

And just as creepy as I thought that the Monitor would sense Cisco vibing and issue a statement.

 

[hobbyfan]

I think the call-back to Smallville was their way of suggesting the show could be retroactively ret-conned into their universe.

SO not digging Amazo. CIsco hit it right on the button likening it to a T-1000 ("Terminator 2: Judgement Day"), but it also looks more like Metallo 2.0. The android Amazo in the books had a more humanoid appearance, and was DC's answer to the Super Skrull over at Marvel. The golden, faceless Amazo from Justice League Unlimited would've been a better bet.

Seeing Nora with Thawne at the end of last week's show must've also been a way to write her out of this crossover. She would've been even more confused......

You can already see that Deegan is a major league loser cliche brought to life. His story ain't gonna end well.