"Stargirl" Season One Talkback (Spoilers)

[Yojimbo]

How 'bout both?

True. Did they know in the comics?

 

[hobbyfan]

True. Did they know in the comics?

Since I never read Stars & STRIPE, I don't know.

 

[Road to Gotham]

Another outstanding fight scene this time between Stargirl and Shiv with Sir Justin saving the day.

Back to the Future actress Lea Thompson directed this episode.
Nice interview with her.

‘DC’s Stargirl’ Director Lea Thompson Takes You Inside “Shiv Part One”

Decider talked to Thompson about that brutal fight scene, working with the cast, and yes, a little bit about everyone’s favorite time-travel comedy trilogy.

decider.com

 

[Yojimbo]

"Shiv Part Two" - Episode 8
After Courtney gets herself into some trouble following an unexpected confrontation, Pat decides they need to come clean to Barbara. Meanwhile, Cindy takes heat from her father after a plan to take matters into her own hands goes awry. Finally, Yolanda, Beth and Rick lead an investigation into one of their own classmates.

 

[reflection01]

Man oh man. Great job building the tension and advancing the plot. Wow. They really aren’t pulling any punches with respect to secret identities or holding back on fights. I love when stories just let the characters be powerful, make smart connections, and make mistakes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[Fone Bone]

Stargirl "Shiv, Part Two"

That was pretty dang good, but the first half was better than the second.

I liked it because it involved the heroes talking out their problems, and trying to navigate what their responsibilities to each other are. I like Pat's scene talking to the staff, and Courtney telling Pat not to tell Barb yet, and even Mike telling Courtney he was glad she was her sister. This was the first episode I didn't wish Mike was dead, so that's something.

Cindy knowing who Courtney is, and then going through with that terrifying charade with the chocolates, says she's an irredeemable sociopath. Henry learning the secret at the end is another thing to say Courtney's Secret ID appears to be on a limited clock.

I didn't like last week much, but I sure did this week. ****1/2.

 

[Marvelman02]

Without having read any of the other comments, this is my take on Shiv Part 2...

Brec Bassinger as Courtney continues to be immensely likeable. Cindy said what I was thinking last week: there is no way that anybody who has spent any significant time with Courtney would not know who is behind that mask. Not just talking physically. Courtney has a very distinctive personality.

There was some stuff I did not like. I thought the scene between Court and Mike was too on the nose. I would have preferred to have watched their relationship evolve over time than have their conflict resolved in one scene over pizza bites. Sometimes explanations ruin things. Unless Geoff thinks his audience is not smart enough to infer why Mike dislikes Courtney? I like the character development but I am also frustrated sometimes by the lack of super-heroics. The formula seems to be: 35 minutes of drama and five minutes of action at the end. Maybe Geoff is saving money for Solomon Grundy? I hope the move to the CW will raise the show's budget for more action and sfx.

 

[Frontier]

Maintaining secret identities can be a messy business. They should probably come clean now before things get even more complicated .

What is under Dragon King's hood? Can he breathe fire ?

Beth finally steps up and plays the voice of reason for the team, fitting for Dr. Mid-Nite. Of course, going up straight to their house with no deep plan wasn't smart, but at least the effort was there .

The show almost had me fooled with Cindy's talk with Courtney before she mentioned the Staff. Cindy seemed so genuine, and might really have been, but she was just buttering up Courtney for the reveal. These two are shaping up to be compelling rivals .

Is there no particular reason Pat couldn't have been Beth's biological dad? As far as I'm aware bi-racial kids can still be darker-skinned .

AI!Charles McNider commenting on how Pat's put on a few pounds since they last saw each other .

So there are no records of Cindy's stepmom anywhere? Who is this woman and how exactly did she end up with Ito and his daughter? She seems to act like she had a life before she got roped into being Cindy's handler, more or less, but there's no record of her existence .

Cindy was sloppy letting a picture of her dad when he still looked human hanging around in her room. I get she probably wanted to know what he looked like before he made himself what he is now, but that's leaving crucial evidence behind that could be used to figure out Ito is Dragon King. Granted, she probably didn't think anyone would have hi-tech goggles that would've been able to do all the research in a split-second after seeing the picture. It also seems like Pat knew who Ito was just from the picture .

I was surprised to see Cindy call her stepmom "mom," especially when she was in her room and was sure there was no one there .

What is it about Pat Dugan that he attracts housewives of Supervillains ?

Hank having the appropriate reaction to realizing he has telepathy and his dad was secretly a Supervillain working for a team of Supervillains bent on destroying a team of Superheroes in a secret war going on in Blue Valley .

Icicle's transformation FX are so cool. I think he looks better then Iceman did in the X-Men movies .

Well, at least the Staff listened to Pat enough to resist Courtney for five seconds before she talks it into going with her .

Courtney apparently didn't learn anything from her beatdown and still rushes into a fight with Shiv that she can't win. Shiv didn't even have her weapon and she still had Courtney on the ropes. If it wasn't for Brainwave Jr. she might be dead. The worst part is the fight didn't even need to happen because the rest of the team got out of there long before Courtney showed up .

I hope the move to the CW will raise the show's budget for more action and sfx.

People seem more concerned about the opposite happening...

 

[Yojimbo]

So there are no records of Cindy's stepmom anywhere? Who is this woman and how exactly did she end up with Ito and his daughter? She seems to act like she had a life before she got roped into being Cindy's handler, more or less, but there's no record of her existence .

I was surprised to see Cindy call her stepmom "mom," especially when she was in her room and was sure there was no one there .

I was starting to think a clone of Cindy's birth mother who Ito has had to "train" like those underlings. But I guess they kidnapped a "candidate," then used Gambler to expunge her records and therefore existence before Blue Valley.

 

[reflection01]

We know her stepmom isn’t that trained because she made a move on Pat. She doesn’t seem like a drone. Somewhere between neglected housewife and mind control. The “I used to do other things” line was interesting.

With respect to Mike, I think Geoff wanted us to know Mike understands how he feels about Courtney. Good move.

Man. Can’t say enough good things about this show. Just when they ratcheted up the tension, Stargirl crashed through the window. Damn.

 

[Marvelman02]

How could those drones overpower Shiv? They don't seem that formidable. Did they drug her?

 

[hobbyfan]

In the books, Dr. Ito (Dragon King) experimented on himself, leading to a mutation, which explains why he's masked. To an extent, given his history, it seems he also made himself immortal at the same time.

And here I thought he was DC's answer to Baron Zemo over at Marvel. Dragon King is actually a Roy Thomas creation (All-Star Squadron), dating back to the early 80's. Hmm, now there's someone Geoff could recruit to be a guest writer.....!

The next time Pat takes the kids on a recon mission, maybe he'd better have them binge on, oh, I don't know. Mission: Impossible reruns? Passing Beth off as an adoptive daughter? Awkward, but the improv seemed to work. I wonder if Barb knows about Pat's charms on other women....!

 

[Yojimbo]

"Brainwave" - Episode 9
Tensions rise among the JSA members after Courtney suggests who she wants to recruit next to the team. Meanwhile, Barbara invites Jordan and his family over for dinner, and Henry Jr. makes a surprising discovery about his father.

 

[Frontier]

So we get a parallel origin story with OG!Brainwave and Brainwave Jr., watching both of them discover their power and the corruptive influence it has on the both of them .

I wasn't expecting this show would stay so true to the JSA mythos as it has, let alone introduce a comic-accurate Seven Soldiers of Victory with classic Green Arrow and Speedy. Speaking of, was it deliberate that those two were the only ones Pat didn't name? Because they were the biggest names? Unless Earth-2 Green Arrow was actually called "Robin Hood" .

So the Seven Soldiers of Victory had eight members...who did they not count? I guess it's got to be either Stripesy or Speedy, but knowing Pat's luck it was probably him .

Does Yolanda still not know that it was Cindy who leaked the photos using Henry's phone? He didn't seem to know she was going to do it. I mean, I guess he's culpable in some respect but he doesn't seem to be 100% responsible like Yolanda seems to think he is .

None of the ISA except Jordan seem to care for Dragon King at all. Although Jordan probably realizes how much they need Ito so they can't lose him. Do they know he gave Ito Wizard's body ?

The ISA's big plan is a mass-brainwashing plot, but what are they going to brainwash them into doing ?

I guess it would be difficult for a telepath to have faith in humanity, at least when you've already had a depressing life up to that point and had to live up to a domineering and cold father. Will the JSA be able to restore Henry's belief in humanity's better angels ?

At least Courtney's mask is effective enough that Icicle can't recognize her like Cindy did, but admittedly he only saw her one time .

Wow, even the Mahkents' grace is hardcore. I'm really wary of the grandparents now .

In a dangerous games of Superheroes and Supervillains, something as casual as holding a scalding plate is enough to tip the balance immensely. And Jordan probably has no idea he even did it .

That...that is not how I was expecting Barbara to find out about the Superhero business. But it was also very Barbara .

 

[Fone Bone]

Stargirl "Brainwave"

Here's the good thing about this show: There are no small episodes where nothing happens. I'm pretty sure at some point they are going to run out of major things for the characters to reveal to each other, but until they do, this show blows through what would be another show's midseason finale pretty much every week.

I decided to perform a thought experiment upon the previews of last week of Courtney wanting to recruit Henry for the heroes. I thought I'd list the pros and cons of the idea.

Pros:

Henry already knows the secret, and it's better to have somehow who does and has that specific power on your side instead of against you. It makes a certain kind of sense tactically even if Courtney is foolishly believing Henry's a good person deep down.

Cons:

Everything else. It's not just that Yolanda could never trust him, and he could never gel with the team because of that. It's that every single support system or possible influence in his life is absolutely toxic, and his specific superpower can pretty much only be used to hurt other people. Even before Courtney hears him declare every person in the world a monster, because of his background and power, he is the definition of a "red flag". In reality he'd be pulled out of the line for additional screening. They wouldn't make him airport security.

Good news for Pat: He won't have to lie to Barb anymore. Bad news: The idea that Jordan is Icicle is going to be a knock-down drag-out fight. What kills me is that the reason it will be is that Jordan is a nice guy deep down. Yeah, his Norwegian parents are creeps (does he actually have to untie them before they go out to visit company?) but despite the fact that he's an evil villain, his personal life is above reproach. I always found that an interesting approach on this show, and potential conflict with Barb this early on says it is probably going to pay dramatic dividends in season freaking one, which is all kinds of amazing and fabulous.

Cindy killed her mother? Done with that character.

I like Court poking holes at the numerals in the Seven Soldiers' team name, and us learning they were all still alive (and Shining Knight is the janitor). I can't wait to meet Vigilante. I'm betting he's cooler than Arrow's appalling version. He certainly couldn't be any worse.

What I like about this show (so far at least) is that it has huge game-changing revelations every week, and somehow has so far done it all without killing off any of the main cast. That's actually how drama SHOULD be told on television. It annoys me it is rare, but I will give the show credit for being one of the few shows to understand what character drama actually entails, and that there are larger and more important themes to portray than merely grief and misery. I wish other shows understood that.

This is all good stuff. *****.

 

[Otaku-sempai]

So the Seven Soldiers of Victory had eight members...who did they not count? I guess it's got to be either Stripesy or Speedy, but knowing Pat's luck it was probably him .

The odd man out was the Crimson Avenger's sidekick Wing, at least in the comic.

 

[hobbyfan]

I wasn't expecting this show would stay so true to the JSA mythos as it has, let alone introduce a comic-accurate Seven Soldiers of Victory with classic Green Arrow and Speedy. Speaking of, was it deliberate that those two were the only ones Pat didn't name? Because they were the biggest names? Unless Earth-2 Green Arrow was actually called "Robin Hood" .

So the Seven Soldiers of Victory had eight members...who did they not count? I guess it's got to be either Stripesy or Speedy, but knowing Pat's luck it was probably him .

No. As memory serves, it was Wing, the Crimson Avenger's partner, per the books.

Editing to add comments on this week's show.

I think it was deliberate that GA & Speedy weren't mentioned by name, especially considering it would confuse Arrow fans so soon after that series ended. Perhaps too soon to recast GA for this series.

Anyway, Yolanda's Latina temper sparked up, since she doesn't trust Henry, Jr., after what happened to their relationship. I guess for this show, they'll go with Brainwave, Jr. and either Shiv or Wildcat as a couple, since they haven't cast (or won't) Jade. Courtney's recruitment speeches are getting better, but she is still acting on 1) impulse and 2) the notion that Starman was her dad, and he's not, as she'll soon discover. She doesn't trust Jordan, and now that her mom knows about at least the staff, anyone think Barbara will unwittingly betray her daughter to the ISA?

 

[Marvelman02]

True. Did they know in the comics?

Eventually. Mike was closer to Courtney's age and wanted to become the Star-Spangled Kid.

 

[Road to Gotham]

My favorite part was Pat explaining the 7 Soldiers. Cool Photo of the group.
Wasn't Vigilantes' sidekick "Stuff" also an unofficial member in the comics? Or was it his other sidekick Billy Gunn?

I keep expecting Courtney to ask Pat, "Just how old you?"
Pat has to be in his mid 70's, I think.

Boy, that dinner scene was full of tension.
Now that Barbara knows, they may as well spill the beans to Mike.

 

[hobbyfan]

1. IIRC, Stuff was not a part of the 7 Soldiers. The first time I saw the 7 Soldiers was in a JSA/JLA crossover in the 70's, reprinted in digest format around 1980-81. Stuff wasn't in that story, but Wing certainly was.

2. Unless Pat has a secret youth serum at home, the most likely explanation is that both the JSA & ISA members have aged ver-r-r-r-r-r-r-y slo-o-o-o-o-o-o-o-wly.

I've read complaints about the product placement of Pop Tarts. What if they show a tube of Colgate toothpaste (which Luke Wilson did ads for a few months back)? Then what?