"Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker" Talkback (Spoilers)

Star Wars: Episode XI - The Rise of Skywalker - Rate and Discuss the end of the Skywalker Saga


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James Harvey

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The Saga Will End. The Story Lives Forever.


Star Wars: Episode IX - The Rise of Skywalker
Release Date: December 20, 2019 with December 19, 2019 advanced screenings
Studio: Walt Disney Pictures, Lucasfilm
Director: J.J. Abrams
MPAA Rating: PG-13 (for sequences of sci-fi action and violence)
Screenwriter: Chris Terrio and J.J. Abrams
Runtime: 141 minutes

Starring: Adam Driver, Daisy Ridley, Billie Lourd, Carrie Fisher, Mark Hamill, Ian McDiarmid, Oscar Issac, Keri Russell, Domhnall Gleeson, Lupita Nyong'o, Billy Dee Williams, Kelly Marie Tran, Richard E. Grant, John Boyega, Joonas Suotamo

Plot Summary: No one's ever really gone... Rey's journey continues and the Skywalker saga concludes in Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker. The surviving Resistance faces the First Order once more as Rey, Finn and Poe Dameron's journey continues. With the power and knowledge of generations behind them, the final battle commences.

Discuss Star Wars Episode IX: The Rise of Skywalker right here at The Entertainment Board!

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Freddy

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This was bad.

This movie spat in the face of all the interesting ideas and set-ups of The Last Jedi, in favor of going the least interesting and most generic routes instead, the cut-and-paste Carrie Fisher was so awkward, the running time was both too long and too short (too long for a cookie cutter story like this, but too short for all the new characters and plot-turns to have any emotional impact).

Oh, and Rey's character-arc was completely screwed over. Going from letting go of her hang-ups about her parents and embracing her own legacy in the previous two movies to finding out that she should have cared about her inheritance all along and embracing someone else's legacy in this one.

Why did the prequel trilogy had the best third movie of all three Star Wars trilogies (by the standards of their respective trilogies, not as a whole)?
 

Wounded_Dragon

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It was a collection of good moments, average moments, one terrible moment, but it never really gelled as one movie. Even then, I would have given it 7 or 8 out of 10 for being mostly entertaining until that one terrible moment. 5/10 (or 2.5 out of 5) is a gift.

As for my terrible moment:
Rey and Ben kissing. Not since Twilight have I seen a more just plain wrong relationship portrayed on screen that wasn't intended to be seen as such.
 

Radiant97

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Oh, and Rey's character-arc was completely screwed over. Going from letting go of her hang-ups about her parents and embracing her own legacy in the previous two movies to finding out that she should have cared about her inheritance all along and embracing someone else's legacy in this one.
It would've been much more interesting to explore how Rey comes to terms with her lineage and embraces her own legacy, but of course they had to somehow explain why and how Rey was so powerful from the get go, and they did it in the cheapest way possible. If they were gonna make Rey the Emperor's granddaughter, then the twist from TLJ shouldn't have been a thing. Hell, it probably would've been better if they did a retread of Empire and had the reveal happen there for the sake of not making it look like a copout. This wasn't Rian Johnson's fault, of course. He did the best he could with the utter lack of coordination he had to work with. There's no way that Palpatine twist was already planned ahead before TLJ wrapped and you can't make me believe otherwise.
 
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Wounded_Dragon

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It would've been more interesting to explore how Rey comes to terms with her lineage and embraces her own legacy, but of course they had to somehow explain why and how Rey was so powerful from the get go, and they did it in the cheapest way possible. If they were gonna make Rey the Emperor's granddaughter, then the twist from TLJ shouldn't have been a thing. Hell, it probably would've been better if they did a retread of Empire and had the reveal happen there for the sake of not making the twist look like a copout. This wasn't entirely Rian Johnson's fault, of course. He did the best he could with the utter lack of coordination he had to work with. There's no way that Palpatine twist was already planned ahead before TLJ wrapped and you can't make me believe otherwise.


One of the thoughts banging through my head on the way home after watching this was that, similar to how RoS felt like a collection of moments that didn't quite gel, Episodes 7-9 feel like a trilogy that doesn't gel either. Individually, they each might sort of work as a sequel to RotJ, but as a trilogy on their own, they're narratively at war with each other.
 

Radiant97

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One of the thoughts banging through my head on the way home after watching this was that, similar to how RoS felt like a collection of moments that didn't quite gel, Episodes 7-9 feel like a trilogy that doesn't gel either. Individually, they each might sort of work as a sequel to RotJ, but as a trilogy on their own, they're narratively at war with each other.

Say what you want about the MCU, but you can at least tell that Kevin Feige has a clear vision of what the big picture is gonna be, whereas for the SW sequels, it feels like there was no clear vision and the director/writers of each movie had no choice but to make stuff up as they went along.
 

TnAdct1

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Say what you want about the MCU, but you can at least tell that Kevin Feige has a clear vision of what the big picture is gonna be, whereas for the SW sequels, it feels like there was no clear vision and the director/writers of each movie had no choice but to make stuff up as they went along.

To me, I see that as one of the three factors that can lead to a lot of fans not liking this film (which I'm NOT a part of, as, even with some flaws, was still a decent film). Let's face it: The Last Jedi, in both having it take place immediately after the Force Awakens and its attempt to do something different, dropped the ball for many Star Wars fans, with the people working on this film doing their best to salvage it.

The other two factors that I consider to contribute to the negative opinions to the Rise of the Skywalker (as well as how these factors actually helped me not siding with the haters).
  1. The whole idea that this trilogy is a quasi-remake of the original trilogy, with Rise of the Skywalker having its parallels to Return of the Jedi (which many consider to be the weakest of that trilogy). To be honest, I actually found Empire Strikes Back to the be my least favorite of the original trilogy (due to the lull that the rest of the heroes are stuck in while Luke trains with Yoda), and quite enjoyed Jedi (whereas I was fine with RoS, but was so upset with The Last Jedi that to get that off my mind, I went to see The Disaster Artist a few days later).
  2. Let's face it: a lot of people are spoiled by Avengers: Endgame, and as such they would feel that Episode IX would be underwhelming compared to that (heck, at one part of Episode IX that had me making an Endgame crack). Meanwhile, between how the ending of Infinity War was handled and the way Endgame was promoted, I lost a lot of interest to seeing that film, whereas I was excited to see Rise of the Skywalker, even if the mixed reviews put somewhat of a damper on it.
 

Radiant97

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To me, I see that as one of the three factors that can lead to a lot of fans not liking this film (which I'm NOT a part of, as, even with some flaws, was still a decent film). Let's face it: The Last Jedi, in both having it take place immediately after the Force Awakens and its attempt to do something different, dropped the ball for many Star Wars fans, with the people working on this film doing their best to salvage it.
The ambitiousness of The Last Jedi is a blessing and a curse. I don't fault people for not liking it because its lack of hooks for a continuation makes it a really weird second act of a trilogy. The new, potentially interesting concepts that TLJ introduced simply could not be explored thoroughly in just one movie that also serves as the grand finale, hence why Abrams and Terrio decided to undo TLJ.
The other two factors that I consider to contribute to the negative opinions to the Rise of the Skywalker (as well as how these factors actually helped me not siding with the haters).
  1. The whole idea that this trilogy is a quasi-remake of the original trilogy, with Rise of the Skywalker having its parallels to Return of the Jedi (which many consider to be the weakest of that trilogy). To be honest, I actually found Empire Strikes Back to the be my least favorite of the original trilogy (due to the lull that the rest of the heroes are stuck in while Luke trains with Yoda), and quite enjoyed Jedi (whereas I was fine with RoS, but was so upset with The Last Jedi that to get that off my mind, I went to see The Disaster Artist a few days later).
I agree with all of this except the part about TESB. I still think it's the best Star Wars movie.
  1. Let's face it: a lot of people are spoiled by Avengers: Endgame, and as such they would feel that Episode IX would be underwhelming compared to that (heck, at one part of Episode IX that had me making an Endgame crack). Meanwhile, between how the ending of Infinity War was handled and the way Endgame was promoted, I lost a lot of interest to seeing that film, whereas I was excited to see Rise of the Skywalker, even if the mixed reviews put somewhat of a damper on it.
Eh, Endgame never crossed my mind going into this. I had low expectations for TRoS because the ending of TLJ killed my interest in what comes next. Plus it was co-written by the guy who co-wrote Batman v Superman so there's that.
 

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6 out 10, and I'm being generous, being a lifelong SW fan. Some interesting moments, but mostly just crazy and confusing. The biggest mistake of them all was bringing in Palpatine when you make NO allusion to his reappearance in the two prior movies. Pretty much forgot about ROS as soon as I walked out of the theater.

Kennedy's job has GOT to be on the line now. She has done a MISERABLE job of guiding this franchise: hiring Trevorrow in the first place for EP9; firing Lord and Miller during the middle of Solo, which ultimately contributed to Solo's dismal showing at the Box Office; firing Trevorrow right before production of EP9, and then in a panic move, hiring JJ Abrams again, a director probably exhausted from Star Wars after directing TFA.

I suppose it all depends on ROS Box Office, but I suspect its going to underperform, largely because of bad reviews and zero appeal for repeat viewings. But we shall see.
 

5YearsOnEastCoast

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Why would the filmmakers want to undo what the previous movie was doing in the next movie? It could lead do a huge backlash, in fact a huge backlash did happen because of this.
 

TnAdct1

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I agree with all of this except the part about TESB. I still think it's the best Star Wars movie.
...and I respect your opinion.

ESB is no ways a bad film, and it still has some memorable moments that I would rewatch. However, it does seem harder for me to get through when compared to ANH and RotJ due to the lull in the middle act (which I'm sure others would not have a problem with).

The biggest mistake of them all was bringing in Palpatine when you make NO allusion to his reappearance in the two prior movies.
IMO, I think the issue with Palpatine appearing all of the sudden can be contributed to two things:
  1. The obvious problem of The Last Jedi deciding to do its own thing, thus wrecking the trilogy.
  2. The trilogy only now introducing General Pryde, someone who has been a Palpatine supporter since the original trilogy.
I've been considering ways to fix the trilogy (based on my own thoughts and the opinions of others), among what I'd do to fix things is to actually have Pryde be introduced in The Force Awakens (and give some of the bits that Hux has to him instead), with the Last Jedi having a moment which reveals that Pryde knew about Palpatine being alive this whole time and that Snoke was really just a puppet ruler he created to slowly rebuild the First Order and lure Ben Solo to side with him in his plan to bring Rey over to the Dark Side.
 

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Star Wars: The Rise Of Skywalker

First off, when I left the theater I saw completely how and why this film would upset many Star Wars fans. And I also realize that for the most part, Star Wars fans are poor judges of quality. The prequels suck and they hate them for it (rightly), but the thing that makes me uncomfortable is that the things they love best about the franchise are the things I think are the worst things about it. The movie ended on a very un-Star Wars-like note, and I get why people are upset. But what the movie did instead is fix the most glaring faults of the original trilogy. And since I'm the only person who seems to think they are faults, I imagine my positive review might put me out on a bit of a limb. And I'll take that risk to my reputation, because I feel I can explain my reasoning very well.

Let's start off with the biggie: Is it a good film? Is it a great film? Honestly, if taken as a whole, it's neither. There are a lot of problems with the plot, and the movie is overlong and sidetracked with a quest that could have been deleted from the film with no problems. I feel like the movie isn't remembering where the last film left us off, or giving us a sound reason for the heroes' inevitable victory. But again, that's Star Wars for ya, and it's weird people are just complaining now considering the crap they let slide in the original trilogy.

I'm going to do this review in three parts. First I'm going to discuss the things I didn't like. Then I'm going to talk about the things I loved. Then I'm going to go ballistic over one of the common complaints about the film's sexual politics. Here is a preview: I'm probably not going to be taking the side you're expecting me to take based on my partisanship. It's the fact that this criticism is supposedly coming from my side of the aisle which is why I'm so offended by it.

Things I didn't like: I know a lot of fans wished the movie would simply ignore Last Jedi, but I don't think this is what they had in mind. The Resistance was on its last legs at the end of the last film. Things had never been that dire before. Where did all of the ships at the end of the film come from? The People rising up? After the First Order took over they allowed "The People" their own fighters and weapons? And wasn't the Final Order fleet supposed to be ten thousand times the number of the First Order? If there were that many good guys out there, it probably would have been a good idea for Lando to gather them before the genocide at the end of the last film, don't you think?

And if people want to talk smack about that, I'll allow it. But people doing that need to remember what franchise this is. This is me not even getting into a bunch of Ewoks blowing up the second Death Star by throwing rocks at it. This is me pointing out that nobody seemed to have a problem when C-3PO kept repeatedly giving million to one odds on surviving various scenarios. And it's ridiculous they survived anyways. Math has never been Star Wars' friend. You want to say this movie is badly written and filled with plotholes? Fine. But then I also demand you admit the same thing is true of Empire, and all of the other early films. I get why people are disgusted with how illogical the resolution was. I do. But I also think those people don't seem to remember what franchise it is they are actually watching.

Time to talk about the things I loved. I loved the morality of the film, which is good, because I think Star Wars is a wholly immoral science fiction franchise. The subtext to every moral in the original trilogy and prequels is appalling if you think through the ramifications of what ideals the heroes are espousing. A completely wrong-headed and jerkish character like Yoda is proclaimed wise and lovable despite being dead wrong in almost every prediction he makes. Obi-Wan lies to Luke about his parents being dead and placates him with a "I didn't lie, it just depends on your point on view," which made me want to see Luke suck the dude up with a Ghostbusters proton pack. And despite destroying a planet, Darth Vader is allowed the privilege to become a blue ghost after all that after he saves Luke's life on nothing more than an impulse. Lucas asking me to forgive Vader after doing all that, by doing so little to make up for it doesn't sit right with me.

What I love about this film is that it completely goes against common Star Wars wisdom. It is true that Luke was fighting the Emperor turning him towards the Dark Side. But for the most part, Luke and the other characters were operating under the assumption that their righteousness was due to their destinies. Destinies that seem to have been decided before they were born, and without much input from Luke himself. Star Wars is a crap franchise in teaching kids how to make their own decisions.

But Rey is a Palpatine and chooses to reject that legacy. Her calling herself a Skywalker at the end flies in the face of the franchise too by saying that family isn't bloodlines, it's what you make of it. You might think it's corny when Lando says they won the first war because they had each other. But that's literally true. You don't actually think it was down to a rash Vader and Ewoks, do you? Of course not. But while that has always been the subtext to how Jedi ended, I feel like Lucas and the people in charge of the franchise tried to defend the indefensible Ewok victory in hindsight with answers in various books about how Ewoks are more advanced than they look, and how the midichlorians in cells are responsible for how the Force works. In reality, the heroes won, because heroes are supposed to win. Heroes have each other's backs. In a franchise like Star Wars, it doesn't have to be more than that. And this movie clearly believes that if than for no other reason that no part of their actual victory makes sense.

Similarly, I don't believe Ren deserved to redeem himself. But the writers actually took the trouble that Lucas couldn't be bothered with to actually make it land. Vader's decision to kill Palpatine was done because Palpatine was basically rubbing his nose in his face about how powerless Vader was. As far as I'm concerned, there is no real reason to believe Anakin changed to the Light Side of the Force at the last second. He might have simply been bustin' up the dude talking smack about his rep in front of his son. And it's weird Lucas thinks that's enough. But Ben has to make a conscious decision to go back and save Rey, and he literally kills himself to save her life. I was not bowled over by the creepy kiss between them, but he died seconds later, so I'll live with it.

I don't think C-3PO has ever been more annoying that when he refused to translate Sith. Finn summed it up: "NOW you decide to stop talking?"

When the guy wearing the mask showed up to save the heroes in the middle of the picture I was like, "I'm gonna be mad if it's not Lando". So it's Lando. And they give him the Han moment in the Millennium Falcon at the end so I'm doubly happy.

Either Carrie Fisher had filmed more than the producers had let on before she died, or they did like Peter Cushing and got permission from her estate to use a CGI stand-in. I approve of either thing. I don't feel Leia was shortchanged at all in the film despite Carrie Fisher having died before filming started. Neat trick, huh?

Now to go on a rant. The film has attracted a bunch of negative criticism from gay groups upset that Poe and Finn did not turn out to be a couple as they had read in the subtext of their contentious relationship. I am not gay, so maybe I shouldn't be telling you guys how to do your jobs, but that just makes you look stupid and ridiculous, at least to me. While is true and important that gay groups should demand more representation in media, it is beyond galling to try to dictate to writers of various franchises which characters should be gay. Speaking as a writer of fiction, no fan should ever have the power to influence a character's sexual orientation. I'm not saying that people reading things into Poe and Finn are crazy for reading that subtext into them. What I am saying is they have no more weight or deserve to be catered to no more than any other fan with a wrong theory on any given subject.

Is Star Wars the franchise hill gay groups really want to die on? It's SO freaking sexually chaste, even decades later, and romance is barely a thing with straight characters. I would think Star Wars would need more diverse romances if romances were a steady thing. They aren't. They are either unusual or mostly just hinted at. There has yet be any sort of love scene EVER in a Star Wars film, where characters are hinted to have had sex. Not once. This is not the specific franchise to get hung up about sexual politics. Sex has yet to be featured at all.

Just for the record, if you have to cave into fans' demands of your franchise, your franchise probably isn't very strong. A franchise should feel comfortable telling its own story its own way without worrying about a viewer's potential reaction to upcoming stuff. If it's good, that should be enough. I also have to say that just based on fandoms for comic book franchises based on superheroes, fans of those things tend to want the very worst things for their franchises, and them getting what they want has made superhero comics unreadable, and most superhero film and TV projects suck. Fans should not be allowed to dictate ships because fans aren't actually professional writers, or have an innate understanding of what does and doesn't work in the story the writer is trying to tell. Usually the writer already knows the story, or has a rough idea of where it's headed. It's silly to expect a writer to follow your opinions and ideas when you know so comparatively little compared to what the writer certainly does. I think gay groups wanting more representation is a good thing. But demanding it of certain characters is not only unreasonable, I find the hubris of it disgusting. There are bigger and better issues for gay groups to take a stand on. Poe and Finn slashfic is not one of them.

I see why the reviews were mixed. Put me in with the 55% of critics on Rotten Tomatoes that actually liked it. ****1/2.
 

wonderfly

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I liked it. Perhaps more for some of the individual moments, then the film as a whole.....but I liked it.

Random Thoughts:

I was wondering how they were going to introduce Palpatine into the plot, and was surprised to find he was introduced right in the opening crawl test. I was like "Oh, okay. Well, I guess that solves that."

I was one of the ones that didn't care for the direction that they took the plot in "The Last Jedi". I left that film feeling divided, and didn't know if I really cared to see what happened next. I mean, in plot terms, it looks like the "good guys" were decimated (are they still "The Rebellion?" EDIT: No, I just remembered - they're "The Resistance"). How many people climbed onto the Millennium Falcon at the end of "The Last Jedi?" Doesn't feel like they really won much of anything. But then again, following the destruction of "Starkiller Base" at the end of "The Force Awakens", it doesn't feel like the First Order is much more organized (and they were decimated as well by the kamikaze attack in "The Last Jedi").

Really, it doesn't feel like a battle to decide the fate of a Galactic Republic/Empire (like at the end of "Return of the Jedi"), instead, ever since the end of "The Force Awakens" it feels like a war between 2 fringe groups, while most of the galaxy tries to sit out and not take sides. It felt that way throughout "The Last Jedi".

Which is why the return of Palpatine provides a necessary catalyst for uniting the hesitant planets, getting everybody to show up at the end of this film. The people that refused to show up in "The Last Jedi" finally got involved here. I think it worked.

I really liked the character arc for Ben (Kylo Ren) here. The unexpected cameo by Harrison Ford, that was nice. I think everyone suspected a cameo from "ghost" Luke Skywalker (I know I did) but I didn't expect a cameo from Han Solo. I like that they redeemed Ben and he didn't die as someone consumed by anger. I like that he got a chance to redo the scene with his father from "The Force Awakens" (he even got to repeat the "I don't know if I have the strength" line). That was a great "coming full circle" scene.

Speaking of "coming full circle", my other favorite moment is where "ghost" Luke raised the X-Wing out of the water, the perfect moment, reminding us of the scene in "The Empire Strikes Back" when Yoda showed Luke the power of the Force. It was just a perfect moment in time.

And I liked how they handled the death of Leia, they didn't CG her appearing to her son, they just had Ben turn to look upon her, and that worked. The scenes of her body lying there with a blanket over her, with everyone gathered around, that didn't work quite as well, but they did the best they could....but I really liked Ben turning to look upon Leia (and us not needing to see her).

Might have more thoughts later. I don't really care to comment on the negatives for the film (incoherent Jedi/Sith powers and pacing issues in some scenes of the film, etc)....but for people that say "this invalidates Rey's character arc", I disagree. Having this be the end of the Skywalker biological lineage (with the death of Ben) just works for me. Having Rey adopt the last name Skywalker worked for me.

In a nutshell, I think JJ Abrams salvaged what he could in an incoherent series of films, wrapping it up as best he could, with some pretty good moments.
 
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Hanshotfirst1138

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I hate to be a negative Nancy, but I am bored. I am bored with the franchise. I am bored with Abrams’ endless glorified TV pilot aesthetic, his TV cliffhanger plot twists that surprise no one but him, and his ENDLESS fan service. You can love or hate George Lucas (And having finally acquired the Despecialized Edition, I’ve been going through something of a re-evaluation of him.), but the fact is this: what he did in the 70s and 80s was stylistically NEW. Even the prequels at least TRIED to do new things and show us new designs. I may not like Lucas vision for them, they may have angered many fans including me, but they did at least attempt something new. The last great film this franchise produced was in 1980; ROTJ coasted on the goodwill from the previous two movies, and TLJ could generously be described as an interesting experiment. The Rise of Skywalker is far from a bad film. It just does NOTHING you can’t predict, NOTHING unexpected. When the dead can return to life, there are no stakes for anything. If you want to see Jedi battle the Sith, it’s fine. But I’ve seen that. Part of the cache of these movies back in their heyday was that they’d showed you things you hadn’t seen before. I’ve seen all of this before, and I’m bored with it.

Oh, and why do 200 year-old ships not only fly fine, but have functioning fuel after two centuries?
 
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TnAdct1

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For people that say "this invalidates Rey's character arc", I disagree. Having this be the end of the Skywalker biological lineage (with the death of Ben) just works for me. Having Rey adopt the last name Skywalker worked for me.
Let's not forget the rumor that Palpatine is also the father of Anakin. By keeping that in mind, then not only does the ending make sense, but it provides a better understanding of Palpatine's plan for the entire saga.
 

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I'm a Star Wars agnostic, in that I'm not really a fan and never got into the mythology but have enjoyed most of the films when I have seen them. For me this was easily the weakest of the lot (including the spin-offs, though not the Clone Wars animaed film which I've never seen, and I thought Solo was very weak indeed), because it just didn't engage on the most basic level of having an interesting story or even fun or entertaining action scenes. It's a mess that throws everything at the wall, and none of it stuck for me.
 

Spider-Man

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I've seen the movies three times now including the Thursday sneak preview and I've been wanting to talk about it but I don't want to deal with the harassment. Thankfully this board is one of the few places where things aren't too bad. Overall I thought there was a lot of great things about this movie but it's a clunky taped together mess with no pace to speak of. I thought there was a lot of great stuff in here but I wasn't a big fan on how it walked back on some of the best aspects of The Last Jedi. The Last Jedi is my second favorite SW movie (some fans trying to blame Rian Johnson for the state of the fandom instead of looking at themselves is laughable). The film's treatment of Rose Tico is especially poor. It's still better than the prequels, despite my enjoyment/love of that era of SW. This movie is no where near as good as The Last Jedi not even close and it's likely below The Force Awakens. At least in TFA it felt like there was an actual cohesive story and not just a series of scenes and plot points stitched together. Despite the poor quality of the film's final product I enjoyed so much about this. The action was great, there were some surprising twists and overall I'm happy with how things close up for this part of the Star Wars saga. There are a couple problematic things like how the Rey/Kylo arc is closed and Rey's parentage but overall it's a good movie. I just wish they took the time to work out the kinks. I would've preferred they waited another year to really knock it out of the park.
 

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I've seen the movies three times now including the Thursday sneak preview and I've been wanting to talk about it but I don't want to deal with the harassment. Thankfully this board is one of the few places where things aren't too bad. Overall I thought there was a lot of great things about this movie but it's a clunky taped together mess with no pace to speak of. I thought there was a lot of great stuff in here but I wasn't a big fan on how it walked back on some of the best aspects of The Last Jedi. The Last Jedi is my second favorite SW movie (some fans trying to blame Rian Johnson for the state of the fandom instead of looking at themselves is laughable). The film's treatment of Rose Tico is especially poor. It's still better than the prequels, despite my enjoyment/love of that era of SW. This movie is no where near as good as The Last Jedi not even close and it's likely below The Force Awakens. At least in TFA it felt like there was an actual cohesive story and not just a series of scenes and plot points stitched together. Despite the poor quality of the film's final product I enjoyed so much about this. The action was great, there were some surprising twists and overall I'm happy with how things close up for this part of the Star Wars saga. There are a couple problematic things like how the Rey/Kylo arc is closed and Rey's parentage but overall it's a good movie. I just wish they took the time to work out the kinks. I would've preferred they waited another year to really knock it out of the park.
Have you noticed how simpatico you and I are about Star Wars? You and me seem to share the same opinions there. I loved The Last Jedi too, felt this film was flawed, and gave it a high grade anyways because there was so much to love.

Now that you mention it, Rose WAS totally ignored, wasn't she? I hope that wasn't due to internet backlash.
 

Spideyzilla

Wakanda Forever
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Have you noticed how simpatico you and I are about Star Wars? You and me seem to share the same opinions there. I loved The Last Jedi too, felt this film was flawed, and gave it a high grade anyways because there was so much to love.

Now that you mention it, Rose WAS totally ignored, wasn't she? I hope that wasn't due to internet backlash.
Explanation for it here. Make of it what you will. I guarantee you it’s because of the backlash, though. There are other things they could have done with her character. Her role was a joke in this movie, and it was inexcusable. Heck, Lando had roughly the same amount of screen time as Rose in this movie.

I’ve been trying to compile my thoughts into a review here. I still might, but I’m having a hard time. In brief, this movie did nothing for me at all, and I say that as someone who really enjoyed TFA and TLJ. May have more to say later.
 

Yojimbo

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Bit of a mixed bag. It was ok to me but not amazing.

I just saw it today. Hated the trio arguing bit at the beginning, hated the reduced role for Rose, didn't like the runtime, didn't like C3PO's sacrifice being wasted (the hunter's droid had the location all along). Didn't care for how they handled Palpatine's return or that he had a child 60 years ago and it never came up until now. Or leaving it up to us to assume the Sith cult that pops up in this movie found his body in the Endor wreckage and hooked him up to the device. I guess those Knights of Ren doesn't violate the rule of two since they weren't Force wielders I think. Shrug.

But I guess the act of striking a Sith down in anger is the secret method Palpatine hinted at to Anakin in III that he stole from his master Darth Plagueis. And thus his essence takes over his killer and he was planning to take Anakin's at first then Luke in ROTJ. And we're to assume Rey was his back up back up plan?

Loved Palpatine's demise. Worth the 2 hour wait. Way better than his ROTJ death fall. Was surprised by Han's cameo and liked it. Loved that Leia dropped Luke on his butt during her training. Liked the ending.
 

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