Essays about TFOP

[pacman308]

Haven't been following it much lately, especially after the "scandal" with the creator, just feels like things aren't going to end well for that cartoon.

What was the scandal about?

Still, you go and you watch these shows like Clarence or Gravity Falls, and its hard to go back to watch something like FOP. You know what it feels like? These other cartoons are for kids, with settings they can connect with, characters they themselves like (and not the obnoxiously arrogant and self-important staff) getting spotlight, and jokes and references they actually understand. I thought Nickelodeon was supposed to be the "kid's first" network?

That is especially true with Gravity Falls for me. Hirsch really gets you into the plot of his storyline and you connect with his characters right away. The humor, excitement and drama in it is actually well thought out and everybody can relate to it. The earlier episodes of TFOP was like that too. I've connected with Timmy and his struggles and rooted for him when he faced his challenges. I've also loved the supporting cast before they became flanderized beyond repair. Sadly, there was less an emphasis on character dynamics and good story writing and more focus on cheap jokes and lame pop culture references after the 4th season. The show was never the same after that.

It seems like Hartman and the other three stooges are too busy trying to cater to the adults who might be watching their show with outdated and woefully overdone references to 1970/80's material, most of the adults watching this cartoon with their kids weren't even born when these pop culture references were already old.

I don't get the logic with doing that unless they have nothing left in them. If Hartman really cared for the quality of his show, especially with his signature show, he should've replaced his entire writing/creative team and gotten back to his basic roots with TFOP as it once was.

When a lame character like Mr. Crocker's mother appears in what seems like a third of the episodes this latest season, while characters whose fanfic/fanart make up the majority of the fan community's creative content such as Tootie or Trixie do not appear once, that is an indicator that you've seriously failed your fanbase.

It was more like Hartman & Co. have turned their backs to their fanbase in the worst possible way.

 

[alfa9delta]

I was absent from this forum because I used to come here just to discuss on FOP-related threads, and after that ridiculous 'Odd Summer' ending, I just gave up on the show.

But I decided to return now after some months of recovering, and I find this brilliant text. That three-part essay explains everything I feel about this show.
I care so much about TFOP. I've been watching it for around 10 years now and it's been part of my life. I started drawing and got interested in animation - what I'm studying to work with - because of this show. Even my dog is named after Timmy Turner! I used to consider Butch Hartman an example to be followed in the animation industry.

And then I look around and it's like it all changed. It's a weird feeling of frustration, and when I see Hartman's and his new puppies' words on interviews, it gets even worse. Hartman says storytelling is the most important, but the crew he loves so much says they like to write random jokes before even getting a plot. They saying they got only the "strongest" aspects from the first seasons explain why characters like Remy shows up as his description only, a rich boy, ignoring all his previous character development.

I think you should try to make Hartman read your essay. Not that it's gonna change anything (even because I don't think this show is getting new seasons at this point), but anyway...

 

[stephane dumas]

What was the scandal about?

From what I read on Cartoon Brew, the creator of Clarence is in big trouble. Exclusive: ‘Clarence’ Creator Skyler Page Out of Cartoon Network After Sexual Assault Allegations [UPDATED] | Cartoon Brew

It was more like Hartman & Co. have turned their backs to their fanbase in the worst possible way.

Looks like Hartman won't be the next Gerry Anderson. In 20 years, I guess we'll still remember more Gerry Anderson then Butch Hartman.
[video=youtube;KMHEq7KCA6w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMHEq7KCA6w[/video]

 

[pacman308]

From what I read on Cartoon Brew, the creator of Clarence is in big trouble. Exclusive: ‘Clarence’ Creator Skyler Page Out of Cartoon Network After Sexual Assault Allegations [UPDATED] | Cartoon Brew

Wow! That moron is finished. Was the police notified? But from what the article says, Clarence is still in production. How are they going to do that without its creator? They'd still have to pay him. yes?

Looks like Hartman won't be the next Gerry Anderson. In 20 years, I guess we'll still remember more Gerry Anderson then Butch Hartman.
[video=youtube;KMHEq7KCA6w]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMHEq7KCA6w[/video]

I used to watch Space:1999 back when I was a kid. Awesome show. Loved its original intro. Yeah. Hartman isn't going to come even close to Anderson's rep.

 

[pacman308]

I was absent from this forum because I used to come here just to discuss on FOP-related threads, and after that ridiculous 'Odd Summer' ending, I just gave up on the show.

But I decided to return now after some months of recovering, and I find this brilliant text. That three-part essay explains everything I feel about this show.
I care so much about TFOP. I've been watching it for around 10 years now and it's been part of my life. I started drawing and got interested in animation - what I'm studying to work with - because of this show. Even my dog is named after Timmy Turner! I used to consider Butch Hartman an example to be followed in the animation industry.

And then I look around and it's like it all changed. It's a weird feeling of frustration, and when I see Hartman's and his new puppies' words on interviews, it gets even worse. Hartman says storytelling is the most important, but the crew he loves so much says they like to write random jokes before even getting a plot. They saying they got only the "strongest" aspects from the first seasons explain why characters like Remy shows up as his description only, a rich boy, ignoring all his previous character development.

I think you should try to make Hartman read your essay. Not that it's gonna change anything (even because I don't think this show is getting new seasons at this point), but anyway...

You're not alone with that feeling of betrayal. I gave up on it with "Finding Emo" in that dreadful S9. If anything good was to come out of this; it'll end the series as it is and give a cautionary tale to upcoming cartoonists and writers. I still hold some hope for its rebirth in a proper reboot with its past glory, but as it is now its best to see it go away with or without a finale.

I'm very glad DLT had written and posts his TFOP essay. As a fellow fan of TFOP and a cartoonist himself, he had to speak out his disgust and point out the failures Hartman did that brought down TFOP. I think most of us feel the same way as he does. Yet, I'm certain Hartman (or his current writing team) won't take the blame and probably double down on the stupid if given the chance with a S10. Thus, I wish and hope Nick will not grant them that.

 

[RDG]

Wow! That moron is finished. Was the police notified? But from what the article says, Clarence is still in production. How are they going to do that without its creator? They'd still have to pay him. yes?



I used to watch Space:1999 back when I was a kid. Awesome show. Loved its original intro. Yeah. Hartman isn't going to come even close to Anderson's rep.

There's also a gay kiss scene in Clarence that had to be cut out, as well.

 

[Lord Beckett]

I was absent from this forum because I used to come here just to discuss on FOP-related threads, and after that ridiculous 'Odd Summer' ending, I just gave up on the show.

But I decided to return now after some months of recovering, and I find this brilliant text. That three-part essay explains everything I feel about this show.
I care so much about TFOP. I've been watching it for around 10 years now and it's been part of my life. I started drawing and got interested in animation - what I'm studying to work with - because of this show. Even my dog is named after Timmy Turner! I used to consider Butch Hartman an example to be followed in the animation industry.

And then I look around and it's like it all changed. It's a weird feeling of frustration, and when I see Hartman's and his new puppies' words on interviews, it gets even worse. Hartman says storytelling is the most important, but the crew he loves so much says they like to write random jokes before even getting a plot. They saying they got only the "strongest" aspects from the first seasons explain why characters like Remy shows up as his description only, a rich boy, ignoring all his previous character development.

I think you should try to make Hartman read your essay. Not that it's gonna change anything (even because I don't think this show is getting new seasons at this point), but anyway...

Hartman would get no further than a few words into the essay before he gave up.
Heck, this isn't even the first time an essay like this was written. A much shorter letter was written up by the FOP community back during the (then new) Season 5 I remember that was posted on Seibert's blog and Hartman's forum. Aside from some shipping crap it was marred with, the letter had some good points that still hold true today, mainly Cosmo and Wanda's marriage. Did Hartman improve? Haha, no. He gave us some token Cosmo and Wanda make up moments, but also made Cosmo increasingly dumber and meaner. Its as if he took the letter as a challenge, not a plea.

Bottom line though, the show is dead. At least, I hope it is. I don't want to see what horrors that the slouches over at Billionfold will stitch together if Nickelodeon makes the lobotomized decision to pick up a Season 10. There aren't even any fans left to drive off anymore.

 

[SaneMan]

Butch Hartman:
Takes complaints about the last season as suggestions for new seasons

 

[Lord Beckett]

The Hack had the audacity to show his face in public again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRklm3t1Bmg

I haven't watched it all yet, I'm not sure I can stomach any more lies. Tara and Grey are there too at least.
I'll try to pick this one to pieces later... maybe... if its the same old lies then whats the point..

 

[pacman308]

The Hack had the audacity to show his face in public again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRklm3t1Bmg

I haven't watched it all yet, I'm not sure I can stomach any more lies. Tara and Grey are there too at least.
I'll try to pick this one to pieces later... maybe... if its the same old lies then whats the point..

Unless its about Hartman announcing his early retirement, I'm not interested. Yet, I'm wondering if there's something brewing with Strong and Delisle being in the same picture with Hartman. I'm hoping its not the announcement of a 10th season of TFOP. Ick!

 

[alfa9delta]

They inflate Hartman's ego so much.
It's weird to see they all complement Hartman so much, totally ignoring all the criticism that's been going on about the show.
I don't think he's a bad person, and it's a lie to say he's not talented, but he's made some terribly bad choices regarding FOP in this past 5, 6 years, and they act like the show (and Hartman's work in general) is still at it's finest. Well, at least they mentioned Channel Chasers as theirs favorite episode....

 

[SaneMan]

any news on Hartmans future projects?

 

[Lord Beckett]

any news on Hartmans future projects?

Not that I heard, though I mostly skimmed through that video. The cartoon he was drawing up was for charity (his charity I should stress), and it also looked ridiculously similar to that Bug cartoon pilot that Hartman pitched a year or so ago. As he himself says, the go-to formula is "stupid parents, crazy kids". The Comikaze video doesn't really give us much insight. The FOP crew are living in Lala Land. Unfortunately when it came time for asking questions, nobody wanted to pee in the punch bowl, and as such the audience tossed Hartman and his crew a bunch of soft balls. Seriously, audience, if you want to get into cartooning then asking an old-hat cronyism beneficiary how they did it isn't the best way to go.

We did learn that Hartman can imitate Crocker and Jorgen's voices very well, no wonder he uses them so much he is probably filling in for Alazraqui half the time to save money. Otherwise, the panel pretty much reaffirms what DLToon wrote about, in that the jokes are brainstormed up first and then crammed in (I think Hartman on the panel had a quote where he says they try to have a joke in every single line) with animation and music coming afterward. This simply isn't a way to write a cartoon. While they might hit on some the jokes, and I'm sure they are cracking each other up in the booth all the time, it doesn't particularly create an interesting plotline when they reuse the same characters and jokes over and over and as such viewership was dwindled to sub-Cartoon Network numbers in the last season.

The panel seemed to put a lot of love into TUFF Puppy and going from that back to FOP must be like going back to work in a Siberian can factory after a two month vacation in Fiji. Hartman might've mumbled something to deny that, but you could tell from his body language that TUFF Puppy being cancelled and him being sent back to work on FOP S9 was emotionally draining for him and the quality of work on S9 very much reflects that.

 

[SaneMan]

Well, at least he himself is feeling the decline on some level